mitchpee 10 Posted March 22, 2010 Share Posted March 22, 2010 Important news of the day: The US is catching up to the rest of the world and passed healthcare reform today. Although seemingly a facade and sluggish results, it's a start. Link to post Share on other sites
HelperElfMissy 42 Posted March 22, 2010 Share Posted March 22, 2010 I know healthcare has been pretty grim in the US, Mitch, but I have seen wait times for GPs and Hospital care grow at alarming rates in Aus since the introduction of medicare...I know it is supposed to be a safety net, but growing up with Private Health insurance and having Private Health Insurance now - I see a HUGE difference. I never had to wait more than an hour or two to get in to see my GP when I was a little girl, but this year alone I have had to and take my privately insured child and camp out in a hospital waiting room to see a doctor because the earliest available appointment was two days away... Admittedly some days I can sneak an appointment in immediately - but there is no doubt in my mind that our health system has been sucked dry since the introduction of medicare. Link to post Share on other sites
mitchpee 10 Posted March 22, 2010 Share Posted March 22, 2010 I am not too familiar with the Aussie health care system. I can't argue to be an expert on any sort of health care issue. I simply don't know medical inputs/outputs as well as people who work in that industry. However, what I mostly want to see here is some sort of institutionalized program where we aren't getting sold insanely priced pharmaceuticals that are nothing more than a placebo, yet somehow made it through the FDA and are "physician recommended". I understand the perks of private insurance being faster, and if you can afford it, more power to you. I would rather wait the two days if I couldn't afford it then die though. Link to post Share on other sites
pie-eater 207 Posted March 23, 2010 Share Posted March 23, 2010 That is rather important/serious for this thread! Link to post Share on other sites
thursday 1 Posted March 23, 2010 Share Posted March 23, 2010 That is actually news not worthy of this thread. Please take it elsewhere. Link to post Share on other sites
Tubby Beaver 209 Posted March 23, 2010 Share Posted March 23, 2010 Originally Posted By: Mamabear I know healthcare has been pretty grim in the US, Mitch, but I have seen wait times for GPs and Hospital care grow at alarming rates in Aus since the introduction of medicare...I know it is supposed to be a safety net, but growing up with Private Health insurance and having Private Health Insurance now - I see a HUGE difference. I never had to wait more than an hour or two to get in to see my GP when I was a little girl, but this year alone I have had to and take my privately insured child and camp out in a hospital waiting room to see a doctor because the earliest available appointment was two days away... Admittedly some days I can sneak an appointment in immediately - but there is no doubt in my mind that our health system has been sucked dry since the introduction of medicare. quite elitist of you MB. Would you rather it went back to the old way so that the "Haves" can enjoy instant treatment and the "have-nots" none? The whole point of "free" healthcare is to enable ALL to have decent/good access to healthcare as and when required. The fact that you have experienced a lag in access is not surprising considering that now everyone has access to the same level and quality of healthcare that yourself and other affluent people enjoyed, the problem being that the infrastructure has not increased along with the amount of patients. So unfortunately those who did have private healthcare and were able to afford top healthcare will have seen a reduction, from their point of view, in quality, however those who could not afford private healthcare will have seen their standard of healthcare rise considerably. To say that the introduction of medicare has "sucked the health system dry" is quite offensive. There are many people who take up medicare (sorry I must point out that when I refer to medicare, I mean free healthcare and not necessarily the Aus system of which I know nowt about) who are not dole bludgers, but hold down low paying jobs and pay their taxes. They aren't "sucking anything dry", they are contributing as best they could like everyone else. It's nice to say things were better with the old all-Private system when you are sitting on the nice side of the fence. Perhaps those struggling on the other side may disagree with you. Link to post Share on other sites
HelperElfMissy 42 Posted March 24, 2010 Share Posted March 24, 2010 It may seem so Tubby when the frame of reference is the UK version of medicare/and the UK version of health services. However my view is not an elitist one at all. As a child I was raised in a home of the working class battler. My first passport was issued at the end of 1997, when I was 28 and my 3rd son was 6 months old. I got on my first plane (paid work trip) when I was 22 years old, just before I fell pregnant with the first child. I personally took out Private Health Insurance about a year before my first passport when our eldest son needed dental work due to faulty teeth enamel and heavy nebulized ventolin use damaging his teeth. Most people I knew (and I am talking about my personal experiences here) had private health insurance because they didn't want to get caught with a big medical bill. Appointments were easy to come by. Back when I was inbetween my parents coverage and not smart enough to have my own I simply paid for the appointments (with no rebate)...but I had many times when I had no cash, and the Doctors Surgery put it on a 30 day account. Those were the days, huh?! What has happened here now is people who would routinely have taken out private health insurance have decided that their compulsory medicare contributions are enough, and are prepared to wait/not have Dr choice etc, and are the drain on a system that USED to provide free clinics for those on benefits. I myself (unknown until after the fact) was funneled through the public system for an expensive MRI when I was prepared to pay and claim the % refund from my insurer. THAT is the drain on the system. My local doctors surgery routinely charges all consults with a person under 18 and over 65 to Medicare, regardless of the families income - and while I am not one of them - there are a lot of millionaires in this area! It got so bad that the Govt a few years back introduced income links that meant higher income earners paid more - thank GOD!....but I still maintain that a system that was not perfect, but did make users who could afford it pay for it has been irretrievably broken because so many financially comfortable people now believe access to free health care is their right... The mass exodus from Private Health Insurance by people who COULD afford it is the reason I think the system is not working. Our hospitals are being bled of funds because there are LESS people with Private insurance ....NOT because there are more battlers accessing treatment!! What must you think of me!! Link to post Share on other sites
thursday 1 Posted March 24, 2010 Share Posted March 24, 2010 Originally Posted By: grungy-gonads Quote: It's Boy Gorge BOY GEORGE looks like he’s turned into a Karma Cha-MEAL-eon as he lumbers along a city street. The ex-CULTURE CLUB star has piled on the pounds recently. Quote: Boy George is considering reforming Culture Club to coincide with the 30th anniversary of their formation. The pop legend says the 80s icons could play together again next year, for the first time since 2002, when they appeared at London's Royal Albert Hall. "Last time we reformed, there was a point to it," explained the singer of their previous reunion. "We'll see. It's all about my mood at the time," he said. "I think we could do a one-off gig or maybe a small tour. It's our 30th anniversary next year so we may do something," said the star. George's new solo single, 'Amazing Grace', is out this week and follows his release from prison last year, where he served four months for falsely imprisoning a male escort. Link to post Share on other sites
HelperElfMissy 42 Posted March 24, 2010 Share Posted March 24, 2010 Well done Thursday - back on topic Link to post Share on other sites
thursday 1 Posted March 24, 2010 Share Posted March 24, 2010 it is afterall, very important news Link to post Share on other sites
grungy-gonads 54 Posted March 24, 2010 Author Share Posted March 24, 2010 Perhaps he is running low on pie money.... I presume that if they come back he will make some effort to slim down. What am I saying, I don't care. Wasting my life! Link to post Share on other sites
thursday 1 Posted March 24, 2010 Share Posted March 24, 2010 Actually, even if they did reform, how many sickos are there left to go to a porkie reunion gig? Link to post Share on other sites
big-will 7 Posted March 24, 2010 Share Posted March 24, 2010 My guess - LOADS. It would probably sell out quick style, just like the Spands etc. Link to post Share on other sites
thursday 1 Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 Quote: GAUHATI, India – The Indian military has a new weapon against terrorism: the world's hottest chili. After conducting tests, the military has decided to use the thumb-sized "bhut jolokia," or "ghost chili," to make tear gas-like hand grenades to immobilize suspects, defense officials said Tuesday. The bhut jolokia was accepted by Guinness World Records in 2007 as the world's spiciest chili. It is grown and eaten in India's northeast for its taste, as a cure for stomach troubles and a way to fight the crippling summer heat. It has more than 1,000,000 Scoville units, the scientific measurement of a chili's spiciness. Classic Tabasco sauce ranges from 2,500 to 5,000 Scoville units, while jalapeno peppers measure anywhere from 2,500 to 8,000. "The chili grenade has been found fit for use after trials in Indian defense laboratories, a fact confirmed by scientists at the Defense Research and Development Organization," Col. R. Kalia, a defense spokesman in the northeastern state of Assam, told The Associated Press. "This is definitely going to be an effective nontoxic weapon because its pungent smell can choke terrorists and force them out of their hide-outs," R. B. Srivastava, the director of the Life Sciences Department at the New Delhi headquarters of the DRDO said. Srivastava, who led a defense research laboratory in Assam, said trials are also on to produce bhut jolokia-based aerosol sprays to be used by women against attackers and for the police to control and disperse mobs. Just a whiff and you'll choke. People eat that stuff? Link to post Share on other sites
Tubby Beaver 209 Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 Originally Posted By: Mamabear It may seem so Tubby when the frame of reference is the UK version of medicare/and the UK version of health services. However my view is not an elitist one at all. As a child I was raised in a home of the working class battler. My first passport was issued at the end of 1997, when I was 28 and my 3rd son was 6 months old. I got on my first plane (paid work trip) when I was 22 years old, just before I fell pregnant with the first child. I personally took out Private Health Insurance about a year before my first passport when our eldest son needed dental work due to faulty teeth enamel and heavy nebulized ventolin use damaging his teeth. Most people I knew (and I am talking about my personal experiences here) had private health insurance because they didn't want to get caught with a big medical bill. Appointments were easy to come by. Back when I was inbetween my parents coverage and not smart enough to have my own I simply paid for the appointments (with no rebate)...but I had many times when I had no cash, and the Doctors Surgery put it on a 30 day account. Those were the days, huh?! What has happened here now is people who would routinely have taken out private health insurance have decided that their compulsory medicare contributions are enough, and are prepared to wait/not have Dr choice etc, and are the drain on a system that USED to provide free clinics for those on benefits. I myself (unknown until after the fact) was funneled through the public system for an expensive MRI when I was prepared to pay and claim the % refund from my insurer. THAT is the drain on the system. My local doctors surgery routinely charges all consults with a person under 18 and over 65 to Medicare, regardless of the families income - and while I am not one of them - there are a lot of millionaires in this area! It got so bad that the Govt a few years back introduced income links that meant higher income earners paid more - thank GOD!....but I still maintain that a system that was not perfect, but did make users who could afford it pay for it has been irretrievably broken because so many financially comfortable people now believe access to free health care is their right... The mass exodus from Private Health Insurance by people who COULD afford it is the reason I think the system is not working. Our hospitals are being bled of funds because there are LESS people with Private insurance ....NOT because there are more battlers accessing treatment!! What must you think of me!! Why is it NOT the people's right though? Like I said I don't know Australia's sytem and was (as you pointed out) using the UK system as a start point. I still think that free healthcare (paid for through taxes) is a right that everyone should have, if people who are in a financially affluent way feel the need to take out Private coverage then that is of course their perogative. I don't really see why you mentioned your background, I wasn't meaning it as an attack on yourself MB, and I'm unsure what you mean by the dates of getting your first passport. Link to post Share on other sites
JA2340 16 Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 Free healthcare? A right? Maybe! However, people with sufficient income should be able to pay for their own healthcare, surely! The Aus system uses the taxpayer funded (and we ALL pay a levy on our taxes to fund it) Medicare as a safety net. Some people are starting to avoid the private health insurance (and many of them can easily afford to pay) because the public funding is seen as "a right". I've always had private health insurance, ever since I first started work, and have paid my tax levy from the time it was instituted, too! The private insurance gives me the right to use a private hospital, have my choice of doctor instead of "who's on duty today", and still claim part of the costs back as a refund. I think it should be an expectation that private insurance will be taken UNLESS there are good reasons (ie lack of employment age pension etc) for not doing so. Link to post Share on other sites
HelperElfMissy 42 Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 Absolutely JA. Tubby, the point about the passport dates was trying to be clear that I do not come from privelege. I am certainly not of the Marie Antoinette - they have no bread? So let them eat cake ilk.. I just think (using an extension of the metaphor) that the state provided bread reserves should be left for those who need it rather than gluttonously consumed by those who would rather spend thier money on a holiday or a new plasma screen. The reality is that if we were to have a good quality 'free' health care system for all, the tax contribtion would need to be a darn sight higher. I like the way it is now - if you are low on cash that week you can access free medical help, if suddenly the bills get too onnerous you can access free hospital care - but the mindset of people needs to change to make it work. JA see's it. I see it. *FREE* is a misnomer. Health care is never free. Doctors and Nurses wages, infrastructure, medical equipment, tests, drugs...all needs to be paid for. The question is by whom? Peronally I am thankful that I can go to a public hospital and recieve treatment, but by the same token, whereever possible I would prefer to pay my own way/use my insurance, and leave those funds in the system for others. Link to post Share on other sites
Tubby Beaver 209 Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 Originally Posted By: Mamabear Absolutely JA. that the state provided bread reserves should be left for those who need it rather than gluttonously consumed by those who would rather spend thier money on a holiday or a new plasma screen. put that way then yeah I would actually agree with you! I know free healthcare isn't "Free" and thats one of the reasons tax is so high in the UK. JA I DO think of it as a right, I feel that healthcare should be free for all to use, but actually the way MB has described it, then I would also agree that it is probably best if those who can afford it be encouraged to purchase and use private healthcare to enable the system to stay ahead and maximise care. For the record I LOATHE having to pay Health Insurance! Link to post Share on other sites
HelperElfMissy 42 Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 Hey,....me too Tubby. I hate writing out that cheque. That and the house insurance (which I am gonna have to access after the storms yesterday), and the life insurance (touch wood we don't need that any time soon), and the car insurance (which is next to useless if the kids are driving).... The price of being a grown up. Or you can be like Papa's folks who live in State accomodation, on state benefits, no insurance of any kind, and then find it a crisis when something goes wrong. Not that I don't love his parents - specially love his Mum, but she has been at the "mercy of..." her whole life. I want to be more empowered and in control than that. Link to post Share on other sites
Tubby Beaver 209 Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 I don't see it the same though. House Insurance and health Insurance are not the same IMO. House insurance is a personal choice, whether you wanna risk not having it (as I don't) and perhaps things going awry. But your health is important and I don't see why a company should get rich on people's health. "The price of being a grown up"...I don't think so Link to post Share on other sites
HelperElfMissy 42 Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 had an onsen, few G&Ts and a nice meal ... You are right. Link to post Share on other sites
Go Native 70 Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 Don't they still add an extra levy on people who earn over a certain amount who don't have private health in Aus? They used to when I was there. I'm totally with Tubby on this one though. For all it's faults something like Medicare is in my opinion essential and a right of all who live in a country as rich as Australia. The right to access healthcare should never just be for the wealthy. And there's no reason the wealthy should have access to better healthcare than a poor person. Income disparity between the rich and poor has grown significantly over the last 20 years in Aus, like most other western countries, so now more than ever the country can easily afford universal health cover. The rich in Aus have only got a hell of a lot richer. I'm all for taxing the buggers more to improve things like health care. And I used to be in the top tax bracket and believe me was more than prepared to pay more taxes when I was there. It actually made me sick when the Howard government kept giving high income earners tax breaks throughout their time in office instead of fixing up things like healthcare. Link to post Share on other sites
BagOfCrisps 24 Posted March 26, 2010 Share Posted March 26, 2010 Top story in todays Daily Mail Quote: Teenage hairdresser dies in explosion after cigarette ignites hair bleach left in her car Link to post Share on other sites
thursday 1 Posted March 26, 2010 Share Posted March 26, 2010 was it a BMW Z3? Link to post Share on other sites
2pints-mate 0 Posted March 26, 2010 Share Posted March 26, 2010 Whats the longest word you can make from this? Link to post Share on other sites
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