Tubby Beaver 209 Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 but considering you CAN get a day trip to Hakuba and Shiga Kogen and its an extra 2hrs or so on the "shuttle" bus from Nagano station…….a 20-30 min ride from Iiyama station is nothing…..I don't think cost will be a problem as they'll run shink deals to promote use of the line (Edit: stitched up by apple again!! ) Link to post Share on other sites
pie-eater 207 Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 they'll run stink deals to promote use of the line Sounds smelly to me! Link to post Share on other sites
Tubby Beaver 209 Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 Haha.....I didn't say they'd be good! Link to post Share on other sites
SKI 15 Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 Sorry I might have missed is there a fixed day for it's opening? Link to post Share on other sites
pie-eater 207 Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 I think it's still just set for "Spring 2015". 2014年度末 implies maybe before end of March? Iiyama Station 29.9km from Nagano Station. Joetsu Myoko Station a further 29.3km out. Link to post Share on other sites
SKI 15 Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 I thought they would be a bit furhter distance wise actually. Link to post Share on other sites
Slippery Jim 65 Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 30km between shinkansen stations is total nonsense, but of course politics rules. Link to post Share on other sites
NoFakie 45 Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 It looks like most of the Niigata stations on the Joetsu Shinkansen are a similar distance apart. Wiki says the masterplan for the Hokuriku Shinkansen is from 1970, so don't be surprised if the number of passengers isn't quite what was in the projections. I guess they are competing with buses from Nagano station, but the existing Myoko Kogen and Togari/Nozawa stations both only get about 300 passengers a day on average. Link to post Share on other sites
SKI 15 Posted June 5, 2014 Share Posted June 5, 2014 Wasn't the master(bate) plan for the Joetsu Shinkansen pushed through by the PM who was from Urasa, hence Urasa eventually getting a shink station? Urasa is 30km from Yuzawa, but I heard that originally Muikamachi was going to perhaps get it (which is just 20km from Yuzawa). Link to post Share on other sites
sanjo 2 Posted June 5, 2014 Share Posted June 5, 2014 It looks like most of the Niigata stations on the Joetsu Shinkansen are a similar distance apart. Yes it hardly gets it's speed up. Just to confuse matters. There is no Joetsu station/stop on the Joetsu Shinkansen. And it doesn't even go through the Joetsu region. But there will be a Joetsu (Myoko) station on the Hokuriku Shinkansen. That'll confuse a few. Link to post Share on other sites
NoFakie 45 Posted June 5, 2014 Share Posted June 5, 2014 I'm sure it was all very corrupt. The same dude, Tanaka Kakuei, made it so that the tolls from the highways would all be pooled, so the popular ones would pay for the non-popular ones. According to their original charter, the Tomei, Chuo etc. would all become toll-free once their construction costs had been covered, which happened years ago. As it is, they end up subsidizing lots of great big highways through inaka with huge long tunnels and no traffic going through them. Hokuriku getting a shinkansen in the masterplan was possibly part of the deal to get Niigata one early on. The large number of stops on what is supposed to be a high speed line will also be to appease lots of people. You can hear the same "me! me!" when they talk about the linear Shinkansen. Looking at Myoko Kogen Station again, wiki says passenger numbers have halved in 12 years. Its the same for next door Kurohime Station, another tourist area. They only get 150 or so more passengers than their neighbouring stations that will get an insignificant number of tourists. That is, the train is only bringing in three busloads of tourists a day at most (possibly less because of differences in local population density, access etc.). Since passenger numbers have not fallen so heavily at such neighbouring stations, it suggests that it's tourist numbers that are falling rapidly, not the number of local people using the train. The situation is the same for Nozawa/Togari Station and the line its on. Anyway, the idea that lots of train-using people are going to start going there by Shinkansen all seems very dubious. Link to post Share on other sites
nagoid 4 Posted June 5, 2014 Share Posted June 5, 2014 Very interesting. Link to post Share on other sites
charlotte 0 Posted June 5, 2014 Share Posted June 5, 2014 I think I'd still use local. Link to post Share on other sites
cal 6 Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 I'm very surprised at the number of people using the stations. They are crazy low. Link to post Share on other sites
NoFakie 45 Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 Yeah, only 300 a day on average for Myoko Kogen, Nozawa/Togari, and indeed for Hakuba Station. You then have to subtract the number of kids going to school in a neighbouring town or city and oldies going wherever to get the number of tourists. It won't be very many, esp when counted in coach loads. The line through Hakuba running north of Hakuba to Itoigawa is a total waste of money and should be replaced with minibuses running along the road that is, err, parallel to the train line. Keeping the line open for nine largely empty two-carriage trains a day must cost an absolute fortune per passenger. Link to post Share on other sites
muikabochi 208 Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 I know next to nothing about the Hakuba line, and even less about how the financials work for running a train line! But, the local Joetsu line in this area seems to get lots more 'freight' (if that's the right word) trains going through than passenger ones. Link to post Share on other sites
NoFakie 45 Posted June 7, 2014 Share Posted June 7, 2014 Wiki says freight stopped through Hakuba in 1967. The part of the line north of Hakuba has had to close during the past two winters for avalanche danger, so it's probably a goner anyway. In 2012, it was for two months. Fwiw, wiki also says that Kamishiro, the closest station to Goryu, got a mighty 58 passengers a day in 2012. That's even with the Azusa express stopping there. Link to post Share on other sites
muikabochi 208 Posted June 9, 2014 Share Posted June 9, 2014 58! Wonder what the 'peak years' numbers were. Link to post Share on other sites
A lawyer 0 Posted June 10, 2014 Share Posted June 10, 2014 I bet a good chunk of them are students too. Crazy low numbers. Link to post Share on other sites
NoFakie 45 Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 On the topic of travel to Yuzawa/Nozawa, a new highway extension opened today linking the Tomei, Chuo and Kan'etsu. On the little map on tv, it looked like the final bit on a big outer ring road outside Yokohama on the west side of Tokyo. It sounds like the idea is to stop folks in the Yokohama region from going into Tokyo when heading toward Gunma, Niigata or eastern Nagano. Depending on where the jams form, it might save you a fair bit of time. Link to post Share on other sites
onehunga 26 Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 Have to check this out. Currently going to Gunma or any where in that direction involves a drive though Tokyo streets. Last time we went to Kusatsu we spent more time getting to the horror highway than on it. Link to post Share on other sites
Tubby Beaver 209 Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 I still have shudders of fear when I think of that horrible road Link to post Share on other sites
SKI 15 Posted June 30, 2014 Share Posted June 30, 2014 It's real Love-Hate with you and the Kanetsu isn't it Tubby. Link to post Share on other sites
JellyBelly 1 Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 More love than hate I feel. He just doesn't want other people to 'enjoy' it. Link to post Share on other sites
Tubby Beaver 209 Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 certainly true.....if I'm on the road Link to post Share on other sites
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