The cost of owning a house

[SnowJapan#Andrew 6]

Yes so many options.

Definitely should go into the process with a chunk of contingency budget.

Some of the optional upgrade costs of things I have seen though have been pretty ludicrous. That's optional extras for you I suppose.

The nicer shower head, 1m rail, shampoo stand and different colours on the bathroom adding 500,000 yen (list price) comes to mind. I'm sure the builders would be able to bring that down a lot as part of their package, but still.

[RobBright 35]

Underfloor heating is great; however, be warned as the cost does add up.

 

Moreover, and this is a personal gripe, avoid places that go アール電化, or all electric. As we found out after the 'quake, it can be a pain. And also add a power shower. Those things are well worth the extra cost in the cold mornings, to ease the aching muscles.

[snowdude 44]

That is a thing we like about our builder not at all pushy.

He sat down lstened to what we wanted and as we had very clearly told him our max budget he then went about making a plan to suit what we wanted.

After several tweaks he got the plan just as we wanted.

What I also liked is the fact he told as early on which bathrooms toilets etc would cost how much along with his recommendations and also told us which things would be highly recommended to upgrade and the things that would be a waste of money.

He really listened while advising but not pressuring us which was great.

We have upgraded somethings such as gone for gas filled double glazed windows to keep the house warmer in winter and cooler in summer. We will also have different glass on the south side to the north as well.

Also we are upgrading the insulation in the walls floor and ceiling because of the coldness of the area.

 

One of the biggest areas of heat loss in a house is through the windows.

 

[snowdude 44]

Underfloor heating is great; however, be warned as the cost does add up.

 

Moreover, and this is a personal gripe, avoid places that go アール電化, or all electric. As we found out after the 'quake, it can be a pain. And also add a power shower. Those things are well worth the extra cost in the cold mornings, to ease the aching muscles.

 

Actually we are going all electric as we are getting free solar running costs will be much cheaper than gas as gas is crazy expensive in Yamanashi.

I know if there is a quake all electric can be a problem but as we will have solar at least day time will be ok and will still have our parafin heater as back up in winter in case no electric.

 

[DoctorOctopus 2]

I wouldn't trust my missus with underfloor heating.

 

It'd be on all the time and our bills would quadruple.

 

 

We'd probably end up splitting up over it.

[RobBright 35]

Actually we are going all electric as we are getting free solar running costs will be much cheaper than gas as gas is crazy expensive in Yamanashi.

I know if there is a quake all electric can be a problem but as we will have solar at least day time will be ok and will still have our parafin heater as back up in winter in case no electric.

 

How did you manage the free solar costs?

[NoFakie 45]

I wouldn't trust my missus with underfloor heating.

 

It'd be on all the time and our bills would quadruple.

 

 

We'd probably end up splitting up over it.

 

Don't get a woodstove mate! She'll have you chopping wood every weekend!

[NoFakie 45]

Just saying, but if you get a local builder to build your house, not a national housemaker, you can pretty much choose whatever fittings, floor coverings, finishes, siding, etc. you want and even buy them yourself, making that nicer shower head 3,000 yen more. You're also not limited to what's in the housemakers' catalogue.

 

I bought a ton of stuff for our place myself off the Internet. All the appliances, the eco cute, every sink, every tap, every light fitting, the front door, the tiles in the kitchen, bathroom, and porch, the bath tub, the toilets....I also got the kitchen units at Ikea. Compared to the broken-down estimate we got off the builder (about 50 pages), buying the front door alone off Rakuten saved 80,000 yen. I guess inaka dealers must be going through another middleman. The saving on the eco cute was about 200,000.

 

Note that the national housemakers will often sub-con the actual building work out to a local builder or franchisee anyway. The same tradesmen will build the house as in the above situation. In fact if you're using a national housemaker, it might be prudent to ask who is going to do the building and then go and talk to them and talk to other people about their reputation. The variation between subcontractors is why you can still get people who buy a Sekisui House, for example, ending up with a faulty house (kekkan juutaku). Your local builder may be able to do something better or cheaper than the package off the housemaker. Some openly rip off the plans of housemaker houses they've built in the past.

 

PS. Our place is all-denka but that was back in the day of a bright sunny nuclear future. The eco cute water heaters are supposed to soak up surplus power from nuke plants that can't be turned off overnight. I dunno if we'd go all denka now. If you don't have snow or freezing, gas-backed solar hot water is definitely the best option for hot water.

[SnowJapan#Andrew 6]

We're using a local builder and for options/upgrades go with a few things with them and request some things of our own as well.

I imagine some people might just like the simplicity of choosing options that they offer. After all, it's very time consuming doing it all yourself. But hopefully rewarding in the end.

[DumbStick 13]

Ah yes, attractive options and upgrades. Damn them! Damn them all to hell!!

 

[snowdude 44]

Actually we are going all electric as we are getting free solar running costs will be much cheaper than gas as gas is crazy expensive in Yamanashi.

I know if there is a quake all electric can be a problem but as we will have solar at least day time will be ok and will still have our parafin heater as back up in winter in case no electric.

 

How did you manage the free solar costs?

 

Here several of the housing companies are doing free solar panel promotions as they have tie-ups with the solar power makers. All about promoting clean energy.

Especially over the new year period many were really promoting this, we got lucky and happen to get this promotion, so we will have over 2 million yen worth of solar fitted free.

 

I'm sure other areas do the same as it is a big thing with house companies now, but maybe especially in Yamanashi as here is supposed to have many sunshine hours per year, certainly more than for example Niigata.

[snowdude 44]

We have gone with some of the things they have and also choosing some of our own.

We like the kitchen units that they have, which is not their own, housing company own brands are not good as if anything goes wrong then you have to go back to them, which will cost more.

The bathroom ,not sure yet we may choose are own, as we are debating whether or not to shell out the extra dosh for the thick iron insulated bath, which keeps hot much longer than a standard one, but looking at about double or triple the amount!

 

We are going for one of their doors for the outside, because they are special insulated doors with insulation in the middle of the door that fits snuggly into the frame, keep the warmth in and the cold out, and vise - versa in summer.

 

If we go for a lovely wood door which actually we had thought about then some heat will be lost through it.

 

Other things like a big shower head, switchable shower/jet taps are standard so we don't need to upgrade.

 

The Eco cute we are looking at different companies to see which one is better/value for money.

 

As for the walls we are going for nurekabe (painted walls) as I hate the join lines from the panels which most housing companies seem to have and the Japanese seem to love lines all over the outside of the house.

 

Although it requires painting in 20 years time or so, that is not really a problem as I can do that myself and have the chance to change the colour too.

 

The builder we are going with is very flexible and happy to use parts that we choose, which makes it a more personal house and not like a kit!

 

 

 

 

Just saying, but if you get a local builder to build your house, not a national housemaker, you can pretty much choose whatever fittings, floor coverings, finishes, siding, etc. you want and even buy them yourself, making that nicer shower head 3,000 yen more. You're also not limited to what's in the housemakers' catalogue.

 

I bought a ton of stuff for our place myself off the Internet. All the appliances, the eco cute, every sink, every tap, every light fitting, the front door, the tiles in the kitchen, bathroom, and porch, the bath tub, the toilets....I also got the kitchen units at Ikea. Compared to the broken-down estimate we got off the builder (about 50 pages), buying the front door alone off Rakuten saved 80,000 yen. I guess inaka dealers must be going through another middleman. The saving on the eco cute was about 200,000.

 

Note that the national housemakers will often sub-con the actual building work out to a local builder or franchisee anyway. The same tradesmen will build the house as in the above situation. In fact if you're using a national housemaker, it might be prudent to ask who is going to do the building and then go and talk to them and talk to other people about their reputation. The variation between subcontractors is why you can still get people who buy a Sekisui House, for example, ending up with a faulty house (kekkan juutaku). Your local builder may be able to do something better or cheaper than the package off the housemaker. Some openly rip off the plans of housemaker houses they've built in the past.

 

PS. Our place is all-denka but that was back in the day of a bright sunny nuclear future. The eco cute water heaters are supposed to soak up surplus power from nuke plants that can't be turned off overnight. I dunno if we'd go all denka now. If you don't have snow or freezing, gas-backed solar hot water is definitely the best option for hot water.

[DumbStick 13]

I'm interested, for those who have done this.

 

How long time wise from first making a move 'yosh let's look into it' to starting building? And then from building to moving in?

 

Obviously it will be different for everyone but interesting all the same.

 

Thanks

[snowdude 44]

For us we started looking at house builders last year around late summer but seriously from around October.

We decded on a builder last week so about 6-7 months to decide on builder and expected moving in date is between mid Aug-mid Sep this year for us so with all the planning selection and build about 6 months so for us about a year from first thinking to actually moving in if all goes smoothly.

Dont know if that is average fast or slow but that is how it is going for us.

 

[NoFakie 45]

To buy our front door myself, I just entered the serial number on the estimate into Google. A much lower price came up in seconds. I guess the estimate price was because the builder was obliged to go with his regular supplier. Choosing the light fittings in particular took ages though. I got a bit obsessed with it. Other stuff was easy to buy but took some time with the builder to work out how to install. We don't have a unit bath, for example.

 

Just for Snowdude, the front door we have is an insulated ykk one, a Japanese design. Our entrance is designed so that sliding doors could be put in to seal it off in case it got cold in winter, but we've never had to have doors made. The front door keeps the cold out by itself. You don't need a porch or double doors or other things you might see on older houses.

 

Just remember in Japan that there are no government inspections during the build. There is no real consumer protection at all.

[Metabo Oyaji 71]

We probably spent at least 6 months looking at land and checking out builders. We had settled on a builder by the time we found the land we wanted, and signed contracts for the land and house within a week. Construction started 3-4 months later, following endless design meetings (and waiting for utilities to be run in, access road to be built, and soil hardness tests to be done), and we moved in 4-5 months after the start of construction.

 

So, maybe about a year+ from "yosh!" to move-in?

[Tubby Beaver 209]

This may sound a silly question, assuming that you've borrowed from the bank, when do the mortgage repayments kick in.......from when you sign the contracts (for the land etc) or from delivery of the completed house? As you can see I know nothing

[pie-eater 207]

Sounds like a good question to me.

 

[DumbStick 13]

Thanks folks.

 

One thing I am learning for sure is that it is not a fast process. We are "negotiating" price on some land now. This "negotiation" has involved me asking the real estate company what we can do on the price tag, any movement possible?

They apparently went to the owner to negotiate. This was a week ago. I'm getting slightly annoyed that I haven't heard anything back. Don't want to appear too keen but at the same time I really want to know where we stand.

 

To contact and ask, or to wait. That is the question. My impatient nature tells me to call. Perhaps tell them we are deciding between a few plots and want to decide soon... anything to move it along. I'm really not very good at waiting.

[snowdude 44]

This may sound a silly question, assuming that you've borrowed from the bank, when do the mortgage repayments kick in.......from when you sign the contracts (for the land etc) or from delivery of the completed house? As you can see I know nothing

 

From when you first move in the payments start!

[snowdude 44]

Well as you probably already know, Japanese love negotiating and slowly slowly getting to the answer unlike us westerners who like answers immediately!

Whether to ask or not is a decision that you need to make.

Sometimes the owners of the land don't live in the area that the land is, because for what ever reason have moved, and it can take a little while to get a hold of them!

If you feel it is taking to long, ask that is what I would do and indeed have done.

With the land that we eventually settled with, it was a fixed price as it was owned by the local Hokuto ward office, so no middle man to worry about and we had our answer pretty much instantly, but with other plots it sometimes took a few days to a week or so before we heard back.

 

 

Thanks folks.

 

One thing I am learning for sure is that it is not a fast process. We are "negotiating" price on some land now. This "negotiation" has involved me asking the real estate company what we can do on the price tag, any movement possible?

They apparently went to the owner to negotiate. This was a week ago. I'm getting slightly annoyed that I haven't heard anything back. Don't want to appear too keen but at the same time I really want to know where we stand.

 

To contact and ask, or to wait. That is the question. My impatient nature tells me to call. Perhaps tell them we are deciding between a few plots and want to decide soon... anything to move it along. I'm really not very good at waiting.

[RobBright 35]

 

To contact and ask, or to wait. That is the question. My impatient nature tells me to call. Perhaps tell them we are deciding between a few plots and want to decide soon... anything to move it along. I'm really not very good at waiting.

 

Contact them, and ask them. If not, then they lose a sale and commission.

[DumbStick 13]

Just called, the guy wasn't in and will call back. Hopefully that might give him time to contact the owner again and try to get an answer.

I get the feeling that the "negotiation" is nothing more than asking the owner and waiting for a response. They know each other as well, so it's not as if he's out of the country or anything.

Lets see what they say.

[NoFakie 45]

Good idea. We once made an offer on a place, it was rejected, and then the house was sold a few months later to a friend of the owner for the price of our offer.

Had the real estate people bothered to come back to us and involved us in the process, we probably would have upped the bid and the owner would have got more money.

Real estate people in Japan get commission from both buyer and seller, but its very questionable whether they go all out in both parties' interest, assuming thats even possible with two sides of the same deal.

[Tubby Beaver 209]

Are they allowed to do that tho? Isn't that what's called "gazumping"? In Scotland this isn't allowed (afaik it's ok in England and Wales), you submit a bid and all u hear is if it's been accepted or knocked back