Curt 1 Posted July 21, 2012 Share Posted July 21, 2012 This is just so depressing. 12 dead, 70 casualties. This dude bought 4 weapons legally in the last few months. Link to post Share on other sites
norcal 5 Posted July 21, 2012 Share Posted July 21, 2012 I was watching/streaming the news last night...horrible. One woman that was killed survived a Toronto mall shooting. This doesn't even seem motivated, just 'for fun'. These random acts seem to happen alot more lately, in many countries (imo). Everyone needs to calm the F down. Also, did you see this? The dumbing down of society: Link to post Share on other sites
tokabochi 9 Posted July 21, 2012 Share Posted July 21, 2012 Awful. What's wrong with this picture. I have no idea what all that Aurora stuff means you posted above - I live a happy life Twitterless, thank the lord! Link to post Share on other sites
Curt 1 Posted July 21, 2012 Author Share Posted July 21, 2012 The National Rifle Association, apparently unaware of the news, posted this colossally ignorant tweet this morning, “Good morning, shooters. Happy Friday! Weekend plans?” Link to post Share on other sites
Go Native 70 Posted July 21, 2012 Share Posted July 21, 2012 When will America learn? Normal people don't need or want handguns and assault rifles.... Link to post Share on other sites
Hokkaidough 4 Posted July 21, 2012 Share Posted July 21, 2012 But... but... but... it's their RIGHT! Link to post Share on other sites
JA2340 16 Posted July 21, 2012 Share Posted July 21, 2012 Yep, and the fact that they continue to kill each other offers a slight parallel to the decline of Rome. Link to post Share on other sites
grungy-gonads 54 Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 I was watching/streaming the news last night...horrible. One woman that was killed survived a Toronto mall shooting. This doesn't even seem motivated, just 'for fun'. These random acts seem to happen alot more lately, in many countries (imo). Everyone needs to calm the F down. Also, did you see this? The dumbing down of society: Can't recall too many of these happening outside of the USA, norcal. Link to post Share on other sites
Slippery Jim 65 Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 Hmmmmm US homicide rate is about 4x UK's vs gun ownership of 15x US homicide rate is a bit more than 4x Australia's vs gun ownership of about 6x Damn good thing you Brits & Aussies leave the guns to us Yanks, and maybe time to start taking away your knives, workboots & cricket bats Oh, Canada -- well, you're pretty much right there with us at a third the murder rate & gun ownership I happen to believe that the US has a problem with violence, and that unrestricted gun ownership makes a contribution to that problem though it's not the main cause. Nevertheless it seems distasteful at the least for people living in their own glass houses, so to speak, to use a tragedy like this to toss around the stones of ignorance. Link to post Share on other sites
@tokyo 14 Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 What's this got to do with Brits, Aussies and Canadians? Link to post Share on other sites
griller 9 Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 What's this got to do with Brits, Aussies and Canadians? Absolutely nothing. What seems extremely distasteful is people living in their own flag-draped glass house talking like that and trying to use a tragedy like this to try and avoid the real issues that exist in their own said house. Pathetic. Link to post Share on other sites
HelperElfMissy 42 Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 DiGriz, I completely agree that this tragedy is a sad sad topic and worthy of discussion in its own right, rather than being used as a vehicle for derision of a nations stance on gun ownership. But I am not sure your stats are all that helpful. The 'homicide rate' ...... is that homicides with guns only, and is it a percentage of population? If the US homicide rate is 4 times higher than it is in the UK or Australia - sweet Jesus that's a problem! When the ease of access to guns comes into it, it really is focussing on these kinds of situations. The guy clearly went off the deep end - a former med student, therefore highly intelligent, who thought he was the joker - hello break from reality..I would be surprised if he was not found to be schizophrenic and had the break recently, or at the very least suffered a major nervous breakdown with psychosis. So, if this happens to someone in a country where gun laws are more restrictive then they will struggle to get hold of one. The resultant casualties are then likely to be lower. A few notable exceptions have acquired the firepower and created similar devastating scenes (Martin Bryant/Port Arthur being one). I don't think it makes a huge difference with regard to career criminals and responsible gun users. It is merely the disturbed fringe. But that disturbed fringe can do a lot of damage when they get old of a cache of weapons. Link to post Share on other sites
1 4 Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 When exactly is a good time to discuss these things? It never happens. After the outrage over this, it will get forgotten, un-discussed and once again nothing will happen. Until the next time. Which will probably be even more horrific. At that time we will be told that it is inappropriate to discuss the issues. Repeat forever. Link to post Share on other sites
Slippery Jim 65 Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 MB, I agree entirely with you. The homicide stats are raw numbers, no category breakdown. @tokyo, ask GoNative, Hokkaidough & JA, I only mention Canada for comparative purposes. Link to post Share on other sites
@tokyo 14 Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 Ask them what? Link to post Share on other sites
HelperElfMissy 42 Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 Ask them what?DiGriz has taken offense at the (excuse the pun) shots taken by others at the USA and thier stance on gun ownership. 1 is right though... When there are no tragedies fresh in the minds of the community the topic of gun laws does not get discussed. It is an emotive topic. I am not sure why it is an issue that divides people so passionately. I struggle to understand why it is an issue unable to be discussed reasonably. But the bottom line is no matter how much it is discussed the gun laws as they stand will not change in America, the is too much history behind the 'right to bear arms'. Link to post Share on other sites
grungy-gonads 54 Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 DiGriz has taken offense at the (excuse the pun) shots taken by others at the USA and thier stance on gun ownership. Boo-hoo, say I. They're not 'shot' on him personally, but of the knucklehead mindset of so many in a so-called first world nation. No offense, of course. He should perhaps learn not to be so sensitive - something that he himself was preaching to others in another topic just this last week or so. Link to post Share on other sites
1 4 Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 This time will be no different. Can you see one or both of the presidential candidates making this an issue? Oh they will be suitably outraged etc but that's about as far as it will go. I think people should be less concerned about what overseas thinks about them and more about the huge problems they face themselves. I'm American. Not that it really matters. Link to post Share on other sites
gnarly-dude 1 Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 DiGriz has taken offense at the (excuse the pun) shots taken by others at the USA and thier stance on gun ownership. The fact is that most of the world looks on incredulously at that stance. Myself included, can't get my head around it. Are we allowed that opinion? Link to post Share on other sites
HelperElfMissy 42 Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 Hey Gnarly...I am with you!! I am not a fan of guns at all. Just trying to keep discussion reasonable ... Because after all reasonable discussion is what is needed. Link to post Share on other sites
klingon 10 Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 It seems to be one of those issues where there's hardly any middle ground - just the extremes of "I want my guns, it's my right goddamit" or "Owning guns is a ridiculous idea, you numbnuts!". Never going to be a particularly calm discussion unfortunately. Link to post Share on other sites
HelperElfMissy 42 Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 Yeah, but being the exceptionally enlightened skiers and boarders that we are, maybe we could have a crack at explaining our justifications for our beliefs rather than just spewing out those stereotypical gun supporter or gun hater epithets. Sure... It won't translate to government. But hey, it's gotta start somewhere... Link to post Share on other sites
klingon 10 Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 Absolutely. Having said that, I also find it quite hard to process the fact that people can obviously buy these things so easily. And also why "normal people" (yeah, I know!) might want to own a gun. If it is to "defend themselves", then gosh that really is just an extremely sad situation isn't it, and one that is so absolutely alien to someone living here in Japan. I need to have it explained to me I guess. Link to post Share on other sites
HelperElfMissy 42 Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 Ha ha... Just noticed your 'better at boarding than Rob' sig. lol I have seriously no desire to hold, own or carry a gun in my purse. But I might change my mind if I had had someone stick a gun in my face on the street, or break into my house and point a gun at my kids. The fact that I don't see the need is probably a product of the place that I live and the environment in which I was raised. There were and are no guns. I do find it scary that the mentally disturbed can act out thier psychotic fantasies so simply in countries with fairly loose gun restrictions. So many innocent people get hurt in these situations. I just read that one of the victims was 6 years old. Her mother is critical and does not know her daughter is dead yet. What would have been a pretty special bonding time for Mother and Daughter (a midnight launch of a much anticipated movie) has destroyed thier lives, literally and figuratively. If this disturbed young man had not been able to get hold of guns and ammunition I am sure he would have still caused havoc - but perhaps the toll would have been lower. Link to post Share on other sites
surfarthur 22 Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 The fact that I don't see the need is probably a product of the place that I live and the environment in which I was raised. There were and are no guns. You are wrong about that, Mamabear. While doing some repair work one evening at a service station in the Perth suburb of Kingsley, an a**hole came in and held the place up, pointed the pistol right at me and the attendant through the process. When the cops finally caught him (they arrested him outside of IKEA, where he was shopping with his girlfriend, it was on police 10/7), they searched his house and found several firearms including the one used in the robbery. There are definitely plenty of guns around in Perth. Admittedly not as many as in the USA, but don't let yourself be fooled into thinking that there aren't guns here. I don't feel the need to carry a gun since that incident, and if I had been at the time, would it have made any difference? he had his gun out and pointed in my direction, if I had had a gun, and he saw me reaching for it, he probably would have shot me. On a farm though, a gun (rifle, not handgun) is almost an essential tool for controlling pests such as rabbits and foxes. As far as assault rifles, or any rifle that can easily be modified into an assault rifle, I do not see any legitimate reason why anyone could possibly need to own these weapons. Link to post Share on other sites
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