Iran war again

[Ocean11 0]

The propaganda war against Iran is already well underway, but if you're interested in striking a small counterblow of your own, you can email a whole swathe of pols and newspapers in one go at http://www.stopwaroniran.org/

 

If the war against Iran goes hot, it probably won't contribute to the sum of your happiness, so if you've ever hoped that it doesn't happen, please take this opportunity to do something about it. It won't take more than a minute.

[ncorrenti 0]

Good call.

[bobby12 0]

If America were to achieve total world domination - ie. they war slowly across the middle east and then eventually take China in about 30 years or so - would the resulting world paradigm be better to what we have now? If the whole world is controlled by one superpower and theres an end to all civil wars and smaller wars, would it be a better place than what we have now?

 

My opinion is it wouldnt be. Not because of all the killing it would take to get there, but because I hate american culture and I'd hate to see it wipe out other cultures even more than it already has done via globalisation of McDs, Coca Cola etc.

 

This seems to me to be the logical conclusion to what the US is doing here. You can see it in the amount of war-ing they do, and also in the concept behind the star wars program. Whether they will eventually succeed in this I have no idea, certainly it'll take dozens of years, but I'm sure in a few hundred years (if we havent been wiped out by self-imposed natural disasters by then) there will just be one superpower running the planet. Thatll be very weird.

[Ocean11 0]

Well, some Americans are all for hanging the current administration (in public), so I don't think the world domination strategy has much of a future. There are still some very good aspects of American culture, and it needs all the encouragement it can get.

[bobby12 0]

They re-elected Bush though didnt they.

 

On reflection I dont hate american culture, you are right it has good aspects and it's as valuable as any other culture. It's the idea of other cultures being worn away that worries me.

[Yuki's Passion 1]

I dont doubt the stupidity of the president, and his willingness to start wars where ever he pleases but dont think the US will attack Iran.

 

Just look at the situation in Iraq. Day by day the situation is deteriorating. The presidents unpopular war is loosing support back home, troop morale is at an all-time low, Republican controled House and Senate support has been decreasing in recent weeks just to give a few examples. The military is stretched thin and the likely hood of it being able to go into Iran is almost zero.

 

The US is more likely to make sure the Shites dont get control in Iraq and bring "democracy" to Iraq first. You know Washington wont allow a domino effect: Shite Iraq takes control, forms possible alliance with Shite Iran, oppressed Shite population in Saudia Arabia rises up and overthrows the US supported tyrranical regeme. Thats when the $hit will surely hit the fan.

 

However, knowing what a F'head Bush is, anything is possible.

[bushpig 0]

A major research institution has just announced the discovery of the

heaviest element yet known to science. The new element has been named

Bushcronium.

 

Bushcronium has one neutron, 12 assistant neutrons, 75 deputy

neutrons, and 224 assistant deputy neutrons, giving it an Atomic mass

of 311. These 311 particles are held together by forces called

morons, which are surrounded by vast quantities of lepton-like

particles called peons.

 

Since Bushcronium has no electrons, it is inert. However, it can be

detected, as it impedes every reaction with which it comes into

contact. A minute amount of Bushcronium causes one reaction to take

over 4 days to complete when it would normally take less than a

second.

 

Bushcronium has a normal half-life of multiples of 4 years; it does

not decay, but instead undergoes a reorganization in which a portion

of the assistant neutrons and deputy neutrons exchange places. In

fact, Bushcronium's mass will actually increase over time, since

each reorganization will cause more morons to become neutrons,

forming isodopes.

 

This characteristic of moron-promotion leads some scientists to

believe that Bushcronium is formed whenever morons reach a certain

quantity in concentration. This hypothetical quantity is referred to

as "Critical Morass."

 

When catalyzed with money, Bushcronium activates Foxnewsium, an

element which radiates orders of magnitude, more energy, albeit as

incoherent noise, since it has 1/2 as many peons but twice as many

morons.

 

Bushcronium can spontaneously transmute into Pandemonium

 

[Yuki's Passion 1]

 

nice find!

[Ocean11 0]

The army may be stretched thin, but the navy and air force aren't - they will be the forces used mainly.

 

If the Shiites take over in Iraq, they can be bombed from the air too, while the ground troops there can be pulled out.

 

The war in Iraq is not losing support in any meaningful way yet. There are still amazing lies being told about Iraq by the mainstream media. The same lies told leading up to Iraq are being recycled for Iran. The reporting concerning its rights within international agreements, the status of its nuclear program, and its low threat level compared with other countries is astonishingly incorrect. The US military is still obeying orders and keeping ranks. A majority of Americans have been led to believe that Iran is the biggest threat to their country (polls prove it).

 

It was unbelievable that Iraq was attacked. The only way to stop Iran being attacked is for those people who know that attacking Iran is a dangerous, wrong, evil thing to do, to take every step they can to prevent it. Don't be complacent about the risk.

[Yuki's Passion 1]

Im not complacent about the Risk. Look whos behind the wheel.

 

There will always be lies about Iraq, Iran, Venezuala, Cuba, Saudia Arabia, et al for that matter. The public is stupid - but the more lies that Bush and Co. tell, and the more they are found out, the more the public will grow tired of his lies and distrust him more and more...I hope at least.

 

Bush still has 2 more years to dig America its biggest grave ever, and he will do his best to put it in it, I just hope it backfires in his face. Id love to see him, Crackhead Rice, Rumsfeld, and Negroponte in jail.

 

Still just cant belive it - I couldnt stand Clinton as a President. But the fact that our goverment decided to close up shop and try to impeach the F'er over a freakin blowjob is beyond me. And, Bush can lie to start an illegal war and no impeachment? WTF?

[Ezorisu 0]

Bobby12 wrote:

 Quote:

the concept behind the star wars program

The concept behind the late Prez. Reagan's "Star Wars" program was to outspend and bankrupt the former USSR, which it did.

 

With regard to the whole "Democratizing Iraq" thing, it's silly to impose the concept of a freely elected government on a population who has known nothing but tyrants and dictators and expect it to work.

[Yuki's Passion 1]

just found this (havent read it) but it might be interesting:

 

http://policycouncil.nationaljournal.com...4582d93f358.htm

[Ocean11 0]

> But the fact that our goverment decided to close up shop and try to impeach the F'er over a freakin blowjob is beyond me.

 

Did you contact your elected representative to protest...?

[Yuki's Passion 1]

Yes, guess who it was?

 

Newt Gingrich

 

at least he lost his seat cuz of the impeachment

 

the hypocrisy of living in the most republican county in the States, Cobb County, Marietta GA, was appalling. Southern Baptist give me a headache.

[Yuki's Passion 1]

looked this up. Gingrich makes me sick. He came to my HS and got heckled by so many of us during a Q&A forum.

 

Personal life

While in high school, Gingrich started to date his geometry teacher, Jackie Battley. On June 19, 1962, they were married. Their first child was born the following year.

 

In 1980, Gingrich asked his first wife for a divorce. In an often-reported incident, Gingrich tried to discuss the terms of his divorce with his wife while she was in a hospital bed recovering from surgery for uterine cancer. In February 1981, the divorce was finalized, and in August 1981, he married his second wife, Marianne Ginther.

 

In December 1999, Gingrich divorced his second wife, Marianne, revealing that he had been carrying on an affair for the past five years with a House aide twenty-three years his junior. Critics such as David Corn noted that this activity was concurrent with his leadership to impeach Bill Clinton during the Monica Lewinsky scandal and ascension to speaker on a family values platform. On August 19, 2000, Gingrich married Callista Bisek as his third wife.

 

taken from wikipedia

[Yuki's Passion 1]

I like this one best:

 

http://policycouncil.nationaljournal.com...2a161c8ea62.htm

 

Can anybody say Impeachment?

 

Lied about a blowjob vs. Lied about a war

 

which is worse?

[damian 0]

Ocean - it seems that at the linked service is not working right. I cant get past the 'preview message' button. Will try again later.

 

Just to add some pep and motivation to the cause, here is an almost exact recount of a short conversation I had with a guy who I know. He is a big republican and routinely uses the term 'in womb murders' whilst debating social issues in a group setting over a beer. There are 1000's of people like him out there and the balance needs to be maintained by people with a brain speaking up.

 

me: Seems war is looming with Iran at a time when your Army is stretched.

 

him: We could wipe them out in a day from the air and sea. Everyone knows this. America has massively superior firepower and technology. America is unbeatable.

 

me: Do you think Iran will be attacked?

 

him: No. Unfortunately the world wouldn't let it happen, we wouldn't be able to get away with it after invading Iraq. But if Bush wanted to, it would be over in a day.

 

me: America needs to develop a smarter strategy to massively reduce its dependency on the Middle East and oil in general. The oily Arab hand has you buy the balls and your superpower status is at serious medium term economic risk.

 

him: I agree, I am all for reducing our dependency on Arabic oil. That's why war is good, if we wipe them out, we are not dependent on them any more (it was said as a 'joke')

 

me: Doesn't your car make you feel a little stupid?

 

him: Yeah, to be honest it does. America needs to embrace smaller more efficient cars. But I love my truck!

 

(he drives a 5.1 litre SUV and lives in the centre of Manhattan!)

[Ocean11 0]

This page has the all-important gizmo for letting people with a brain speak up;

 

http://stopwaroniran.org/petition.shtml

 

As for this;

> America has massively superior firepower and technology.

matey doesn't realize that this would be the first time his country was up against a largish, politically cohesive country, with a professional, non-coerced military, and some of the latest Russian weaponry which is usually made to a very workable standard. It wouldn't all be a one way street even from the start, and it would only get worse.

[soubriquet 0]

 Quote:

Originally posted by Ocean11:
As for this;
> America has massively superior firepower and technology.
matey doesn't realize that this would be the first time his country was up against a largish, politically cohesive country, with a professional, non-coerced military, and some of the latest Russian weaponry which is usually made to a very workable standard. It wouldn't all be a one way street even from the start, and it would only get worse.

VIETNAM

[damian 0]

 Quote:

Originally posted by Ocean11:
This page has the all-important gizmo for letting people with a brain speak up;

http://stopwaroniran.org/petition.shtml

I still can't get passed the "preview message" button

America could win, but there are two things that come to my mind making it tough:

1. you do not hold ground until there are troops literally standing and holding that piece of dirt. Air and naval fire power can get that bit of dirt obliterated, but America does not have the troops to literally seize and hold ground. That is part of the rokle of infantry, and they don't have enough.

2. They could win by using obscenely destructive fire power (tactical nuclear). No need to seize and hold the final inches. No enemy. No anything.

I don't hope America doesn't have the stupid balls for #2. If they did it, the collective world sociologically would turn on America. They would be the outcasts. And what would be the dire downside of a global rejection of USA? Nothing. The world doesn't actually need America in a desperate way. The only entity that desperately needs America is America (and thankfully not all Americans belong that that group)

[damian 0]

I should add...

 

If America were to however embrace a peaceful non-military locally resolved solution to their petro-energy disaster then the world would need them. If America put their mind to it, they could lead the world in finding and establishing a wide reaching solution, a significant point of modern human history. They are a massivley capable and competitive nation. Put to good use, those attributes are super valuable.

 

The ball really is in their court.

[BagOfCrisps 24]

Today:

 

The US may face "no greater" challenge from any country than Iran, US secretary of state Condoleezza Rice said today.

 

She knows, I trust her. Don't you?

[Fattwins 0]

Yeah but america would bomb the country for 60 days before going in so Iran wouldnt stand a chance,.

[BillTheBinMan 0]

Didn't we have this nuclear strike idea floating around though. Only need for a day or two then, tops.

[js 0]

Soubriquet is correct and reveals the most important facet of world politics - the wheel turns.

 

1st the French arrogance thought their superior fire power and technology could beat a bunch of rice farmers, but they got their asses kicked. 2nd - in comes the Yanks with the same attitude ... they get theirs wiped.

 

The Yanks have never been good at fighting guerilla warfare and never will be due to the makeup of their armed forces.

 

We're seeing it in Iraq - hit and run tactics are what won the day in Vietnam and against the Ruskies in Afghanistan.

 

I hope the Yanks aren't stupid enough to consider nuclear war - the nation that releases that genie will be forever cursed. (Even though the First Gulf War poisoned the country forever with depleted uranium )