cayote 0 Posted January 16, 2005 Share Posted January 16, 2005 Avalanche trainining courses - dragging wearers of transcievers out in body bags This article is a sobering read for anyone going BC! Any recommendations for NON AVALANCHE RISK BC AREAS??? Link to post Share on other sites
SerreChe 2 Posted January 16, 2005 Share Posted January 16, 2005 Hi Coyote, good article, in line with other articles put up on the forum by Montoya that I have read. Sobering indeed. Transceivers do not protect you from avies, just gives you a slightly better chance to be found (whether it is alive is another question). It is a bit like the fact that having a life insurance does not make you immortal. I believe non avalanche risk BC areas do not exist. There is always a risk, it is a matter of relativity. Try to hook-up with responsible, knowledgeable people would be the best choice most likely. Good luck. Link to post Share on other sites
cayote 0 Posted January 16, 2005 Author Share Posted January 16, 2005 That wouldn't have anything to do with the snow depth for Kagura (reported on this site) having been STUCK on 240 cm for the past week - would it??? Link to post Share on other sites
Ocean11 0 Posted January 16, 2005 Share Posted January 16, 2005 > We have known for many years that the more avalanche courses a person has taken, the more likely they are to be caught in and possibly killed by an avalanche Interesting. So, ignorance is not only bliss, it's also immunity. Link to post Share on other sites
sakebomb 0 Posted January 16, 2005 Share Posted January 16, 2005 Just saw this- another tragic story. utah avalanche Link to post Share on other sites
wendy-cake 0 Posted January 16, 2005 Share Posted January 16, 2005 Quote: That wouldn't have anything to do with the snow depth for Kagura (reported on this site) having been STUCK on 240 cm for the past week - would it??? >>>>> http://www.princehotels.co.jp/ski/kagura/index.html 240 it is. Link to post Share on other sites
NoFakie 45 Posted January 16, 2005 Share Posted January 16, 2005 The top link was very interesting and helpful. The stuff about actual post-avalanche conditions was very good. However, you do get the feeling it is coming from a mountaineering page. In "Freeriding in Avalanche Terrain", it clearly says that most slab avalanches occur on slopes that are 30 to 45 degrees in pitch and so can be avoided by avoiding such slopes. It then immediately states that this group also contains most of the best slopes for freeriding. Simple avoidance is too much of a sacrifice for many people, so that is why the imperfect science of terrain and snowpack analysis comes into play. If you're simply mountaineering, avoiding such slopes just means taking a different, probably longer route. There's no big difference in enjoyment between hiking up or down a 35 degree bit or a longer 20 degree bit. BTW, it's looking pretty bleak for those university mountaineers who climbed Shakushi in Hakuba last week. Their mountaineering club have been saying they were hit by bad weather, but every forecast predicted the first storm to hit them last weekend before they set off on the fifth. Underestimate the weather at your peril. Link to post Share on other sites
powda tele 0 Posted January 17, 2005 Share Posted January 17, 2005 Oceans 11. The stats certainly support what you're saying. It's often the experienced, and those that are highly trained that are caught. At the same time, I think that's because those with a lot of experience and training are more likely to be pushing it on really big lines in pretty severe terrain. I think that stat left alone on this site, without any supporting explanation, would argue against doing an avo awareness course, and may even put someone off. Personally, I've learnt more than I can express from the basic avo course I did, the books I've read, and the online reading I've done. I triggered a few small slides before I did the course (and small ones can kill), but haven't since then because I make better choices. I was an idiot to ride where I used to ride, and lucky to get away with it sometimes. I know the meaning behind your comment is 'courses give us enough to fully protect ourselves, so we should be ever diligent'. But I just want to clarify it so somebody new to riding (or the BC) doesn't take the wrong meaning from it. Happy turns and safe riding. Link to post Share on other sites
Thunderpants 0 Posted January 17, 2005 Share Posted January 17, 2005 Statistics can be used to prove any point you like. A person who has taken more avalance cources are also more likely to spend more time in the mountains. The more time you spend out there, the more time you expose yourself to that "calculated risk" the article mentions The more firefighters present at a fire, the more victims there are. What does that prove? ATB tp Link to post Share on other sites
Yuki's Passion 1 Posted January 17, 2005 Share Posted January 17, 2005 Ill let fattwins when he comes online tomorrow or toque mention the slide at Tsugaike yesterday Link to post Share on other sites
mattlucas 0 Posted January 17, 2005 Share Posted January 17, 2005 Fattwins can explain tonight or tomorrow but I will add that there was some equipment loss. His ride would have been scary although from my viewpoint I couldn't really tell he was in trouble. Link to post Share on other sites
miteyak 0 Posted January 17, 2005 Share Posted January 17, 2005 Too many skiers/snowboarders use their knowledge and perceived safety equipment to ski the margins rather than avoid risky areas. Mr Wiggles is right about the mountaineering angle, but to excuse skiers on the grounds that their sport doesn't allow them as many avoidance options begs the question... is the perfect run worth the ultimate gamble? Do you want to die sliding? Link to post Share on other sites
Ocean11 0 Posted January 17, 2005 Share Posted January 17, 2005 Fattwins is sounding more and more like one hell of a hazardous dude to go riding with... Link to post Share on other sites
mattlucas 0 Posted January 17, 2005 Share Posted January 17, 2005 It would seem that way wouldn't it But he is really safe. Link to post Share on other sites
Yuki's Passion 1 Posted January 17, 2005 Share Posted January 17, 2005 Yeah, he always carries a rope Link to post Share on other sites
mattlucas 0 Posted January 17, 2005 Share Posted January 17, 2005 I did a write up of the run on my journal Link to post Share on other sites
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