TR: Kamikochi to Yarigatake

[SnowConnection 0]

montaya, thank you for your info about Japan Haute Route. The route is separated into three sections, Tateyama to Kitanomata, Kitanomata to Sugoroku, and Sugoroku to Kamikochi. The most popular section is Kitanomata to Sugoroku, where skiers get into from Kamioka-shindo(Uchiho), stay Tarodaira hut, stay Kurobegoro hut, stay Sugoroku hut and go down to Shinhodaka-Onsen. Most skiers use huts open in GW week only, so you must speak fluent Japanese for the huts accomodations, or accompany with a well Japanese speaking friend. As per Sugoroku area, the easier way is to buy a three-days BC tour (once a year, GW week only) from Koike Lodge system. The tour is a round trip from Shinhodka-Onsen to Sugoroku hut staying two nights. It is for advanced skiers, and requires crampons. The guide speaks Japanese only. I do not know if snowboarders are accepted. I've never seen snowboaders and Gaijins.

[Fattwins 0]

be a man and camp

[SnowConnection 0]

Yes, you can pitch your tent at the backyard of Sugoroku hut. I am too old to carry a tent and food.

[Fattwins 0]

was joking snowC, but I know lots of guys who tour in Japan and get away with very little Japanese. Toque cant say much and he gets around pretty good. ive yet to be turned away at a hut too. Toque also said possible big snow up high today cause the roads were closed.

[SnowConnection 0]

Fattwins, that's problem really for non-Japanese speaking people who want to have BC skiing/snowboardig in Japan. All are only Japanese, signs, pamplets, and local instructions at rural locations. Mostly ordinary local people can not speak English well, or hesitate to speak Englsh. Hut owners may hung up telephone just when hearing English voices. I had a similar experience in France with my poor Englsh. When I reserve a ski hut in US/Canada, I must have telephone conversation once with the guide in additon to much e-mail comm, because the guide may have concern about my English conversation skill.

Last Saturday, a fine day, I saw no Gaijins at Harinoki valley where Gaijins would be hard to get the local information. The scenary from the top of Harinoki Peak was GREAT! I think such place must be kept as a stache from Gaijins by language barrier. On the other hand, I would want SJ Gaijins to see the scenary and enjoy the new fresh snow fell two days before. Am I a meddler?

[mattlucas 0]

I think you have the wrong idea about things there SnowConnection

 

I have never had trouble getting around in Japan and I have had only good experiences interacting with people in the mountains.

Although I usually stay in my tent I have stayed in huts and it has not been a problem. It's not a language barrier that is keeping gaijin from the mountains. It is just a general lack of knowledge. Almost all gaijin that come to Japan don't come to go bc skiing or general downhill skiing for that matter. While some of us do most don't even realize that there is potential for rippin trips.

 

You just have to have an open mind.

[Fattwins 0]

snowC

Am I a meddler? I dont think so. your information is good.

 

We just dont think you have to have language skills to get around thats all.

 

Now about access number one Japan is easy, there are marked trails everywhere and the exposure in minimal at best.

 

Canada exposure high less signs and marked trails. Hiking in is sometimes more dangerous than the sking. Huts for the most part have no food either. Thus you must look after yourself.

 

I agree with Toque that there just arent that many Gaijins that are into winter touring. Even if people are into winter touring alot of people just dont cart all their gear over here when they do come. It took me quite a few trips to resettle myself in Japan and there is still tons of stuff that I want to bring from Canada.

[mattlucas 0]

 Quote:

Originally posted by SnowConnection:
The tour is a round trip from Shinhodka-Onsen to Sugoroku hut staying two nights. It is for advanced skiers, and requires crampons. The guide speaks Japanese only. I do not know if snowboarders are accepted. I've never seen snowboaders and Gaijins.

I know the area that you are speaking of very well Snowconnection. This area is not for advanced skiers only and in fact I would say it is a great place for people wanting to get a start in the BC. Yes it is remote but the hills arn't as steep and rugged as say a place like the Karasawa or the valleys coming off Yari.
And to say that Snowboarders arn't allowed to go there is way crazy. Why you would say that I don't know.

I think that you do not see many gaijin in this area because most gaijin don't stay in Japan that long. They really only get into the obvious places (Tateyama, Kamikochi area) before having to leave at the end of their visas. Most only stay at longest 3 years and it usually takes a year to get familier with the good places to go. But don't worry SnowConnection. Soon we will find all the secret places and then we will tell the world about them

[Fattwins 0]

Toque you are very lucky to live where you live. You get a nice little playground out there. Imagine where you would be sking if you would have been put in Hokkaido dude.

[Yuki's Passion 1]

Toque would drive 7 hours to Asahidake from Sapporo every Friday night, sleep in his car, ski Sat & Sun, then drive back late-night Sun. Ski Sapporo kokusai Mon-Thurs. and do it all over again.

 

We know Niseko isnt good enough for somebody like you...

[mattlucas 0]

Well like Yama says I'd probably find my way to some sort of snow.

[SnowConnection 0]

Toque, thank you for your comment. I agree with you in terms of "Stronger" mountaineers world. But, there must be many Gaijins who want to enjoy Japan BC snowing with moderate skiing/snowbordering skills. They mostly can not read Kanji on topo maps and bus/train time tables. They do not want to carry tents and sleeping bags. They might not have their own cars. They want to stay at huts or lodges. (For me in North America, it is lot of fun to have chatting with Canadians/Americans at huts after dinner as well as skiing with them.) It might be easy to say that they are not quailifed for enjoying Japan BC snowing....

As per Mt.Sugoroku area, I wanted to say that I do not know if the guide accept snowboarders as his customers. I beleive it is good places for snowboarders also. I do not recommend BC beginners to go to Sugoroku area. There are many hard sections. A Japanese guide book ranks there as three stars grade(experts). I recommend even advanced BC skiers to buy the guide service. Then, I see language problem.

[mattlucas 0]

 Quote:

Originally posted by SnowConnection:
Toque, thank you for your comment. I agree with you in terms of "Stronger" mountaineers world. But, there must be many Gaijins who want to enjoy Japan BC snowing with moderate skiing/snowbordering skills. They mostly can not read Kanji on topo maps and bus/train time tables. They do not want to carry tents and sleeping bags. They might not have their own cars. They want to stay at huts or lodges. (For me in North America, it is lot of fun to have chatting with Canadians/Americans at huts after dinner as well as skiing with them.) It might be easy to say that they are not quailifed for enjoying Japan BC snowing....
As per Mt.Sugoroku area, I wanted to say that I do not know if the guide accept snowboarders as his customers. I beleive it is good places for snowboarders also. I do not recommend BC beginners to go to Sugoroku area. There are many hard sections. A Japanese guide book ranks there as three stars grade(experts). I recommend even advanced BC skiers to buy the guide service. Then, I see language problem.

I have to say Snowconnection that you don't have to read Kanji to get into the Japanese outdoors. I take maps on all my trips and can't read a single character. The maps are covered in far to much Kanji. All you have to look at to get by safely in the mountains are the international symbols. Those are the contour lines, mountain heights, waterfall marks, lat/long...

As for bus times and what not. Japanese people love helping out and more than a few occasions I have been helped out by friendly Japanese people. I don't rely on this though and always leave enough time to get by if there are problems.

I don't agree with your comment about hiring a guide as an important thing. I've been throughout the alps on my own and have not had a problem. All it takes is the ability to read a map and a general want to explore a new area.

Sorry I misunderstood one of your comments there. Maybe the guide that you use does not accept snowboarders. I guess that is his choice.
I have however seen mixed trips (skiers/snowboarders) being led by guides in Japan and they have tackled some very difficult and cool terrain.
I would love to get into the areas that they get into. I'm sad and happy that my time in Japan is limited. Sad cause I will be missing out some of the cool areas I still want to get into and happy cause I'm getting the experence to tackle the even bigger mountains back home in Canada

Thanks for the little debate here SnowConnection

[mattlucas 0]

And there are english speaking guides in Japan

 

If anybody wants the names of some of them I or somebody can easily point you in the right direction.

[Fattwins 0]

Yeah snow keep the info coming its always. Its also ok to disagree and have a little debate. Id look forward to meeting you in the mountains next year for a little trip.

 

Toque is pretty safe most of the areas he goes into he has hiked in the summer (green season). He usally doesnt just do something on a whim either. He is a damn good map reader too, better than most.

 

Toque has talked about using guides for certain areas, ie tsurugi or places that you need to rope into or know when to stop.

[SnowConnection 0]

Toque, thank you for your feedback. I uderstood your idea. I enjoy to have a 1-2 weeks skiing trip overasea once a year. It is sometimes hard work for me to get local information from Japan. I wonder if some gaijins have the same problem when they want to come to Japan BC skiing, and would like to provide them with some helps in terms of language handicap. You do not need my help sure, but some others (especially travelers) might need my help..... I quit the debate with you. Again thanks.

As far as I know about Gaijin guides in Japan, Cveto Podlogar, a Slovenian is an active mountain guide in Japan;

http://www.candcjp.com/

This is C&C - Japan guide record by Japanese Kanji.

http://www.candcjp.com/cveto.shool.sannkounokiroku.htm

 

Also, FYI. I have not contacted them.

http://www.evergreen-outdoors.com/english-winter.htm

http://www.japan-adventures.com/

http://www.iac-tokyo.org/

[mattlucas 0]

FT and I met that Slovanian guide on the top of Tateyama during golden week. He was a nice fellow and really knew the area. He was the one that told us of the cool descent off of Tsurugi and I'm am thinking of hiring him to take us there next year.

But that is just a dream and by then I'll probably have different plans, no yen or maybe even the ability to do it myself.

[Fattwins 0]

Also dave at evergreen outdoor center.

and Yutaka last name toque?

He speaks good enough English to get you into the BC if you needed him to speak english.

Most good guides in Japan have had some overseas advetures. I would not trust a locally trained guide in Japan. Too be honest I find them lacking in most areas of safty.

 

Snow Connection you are very right about some people needing help. It is also good to have a good mannered debate though. These types of debates without attacks on each other lead to better reasoned answers. We will be in Tateyama come Late November come join us if you wish.

 

I would trust that Slovanian guide cause, he looked like he could eat wood, and poop it out without batting an eyelash. It all depends on how much he will cost next year to ski one line toque.

[mattlucas 0]

I was looking at his site and he only does english trips mid-week and I imagine that he will be booked up for GW.

We might just have to go for it on our own

 

Yutaka Takagi from Hakuba

I would trust him. He has been all over and skied some knarly lines.

Last weekend he was doing his guide recertification on Tsurugi. I bet they put them into some interesting situations up there

[Fattwins 0]

We could always hire him to rope us up in spring.

I dont trust those guys in avie terrain though cause ive seen them do stupid things. He also got got in a slide and lost skis this year.

 

We might have to do a little rope training for that trip. Im the weaker of the climbers and prefer to be roped up for tsurugi in the winter.

[SnowConnection 0]

Fattwins, thank you very much for your invitation to Tateyama next season. I would, but am too old to ski with you. I may see you there, but I can walk only one meter when you walk two meters. I've not wanted to be die in the steepest terrain you like.

Yes, Evergreen Outdoor Center has nice English pages, which I fogot. I added their URL to a list in my posting. I've not bought their service.

I think rate of Japan BC ski guide service is not expensive as far as buying their package. I usually go to BC skiing with my friends, but sometimes try to buy their packages for increasing "NEW" friends. Also, it is valuable for me to know a "NEW" guide.

You are the people who do not need to buy guide service in Japan BC skiing/snowboarding trip, of course. But, I need guide service information to advice/introduce BC skiing for the "Japan BC" beginners. I have much info for Japanese, but less for foreign visitors.

Also, I have to know what info Gaijin-sans want to know about Japan BC snowing. This is one of the reason that I join this forum, thanks.

[Fattwins 0]

we are not always crazy in mid winter SnowC but we go crazy when we know its safe. Last year when every other guide went high we stayed low and had great powder turns on short runs. the guides all said that they couldnt see and the snow was wind packed. We thought why bother when the sking was good down low. Even if we just meet for a whiskey in the tent area SnowC its worth a meeting dont you think. Toque will say that I chat too much, if you show up.

[SnowConnection 0]

My doctor still may allow me to have beer, whiskey, sake and shotyu, in my hands (no, no, in my stomach). But, sorry I can no longer ski down to Raicho-zawa tent site from Murodo with carrying a beer barrel on my back. That's must be a problem. You may want a wine barrel to come..

[mattlucas 0]

He does like the talk. I've never seen anybody talk so much. Especially when you get a few drinks in him.

I like to keep to myself. Just the way I am.

 

SnowConnection - It's all downhill to the tent area. Gravity helps. We will even carry out the empties. Next year.

[Fattwins 0]

next year im packing double the booze. no glass bottles either.