bunnyhopp 0 Posted August 21, 2012 Share Posted August 21, 2012 Hi everyone! Really appreciate some help on deciding where to go for our next ski trip in Mar 2013. Considering 1. Nozawa Onsen 2. Myoko Kogen 3. Hakuba Some background info on us A mid-40s couple and 7 yr kid. Planning for a 5/6 day ski trip. Coming from Spore, so flying in via Narita or Haneda, then the bullet train to Nagano Been to Nozawa Onsen and Niseko ( being our first and second ever ski trips). Loved both places and really hooked on skiing after Niseko. Want to go beyond beginner slopes, gain confidence and do the intermediate slopes. My concerns are: 1. Which resort would be good for us, in terms of having good snow conditions at that time of the year with sunny,blue skies? 2. Which resort has runs that are good for beginners going onto intermediate ? Not too steep/challenging, but interesting and varied enough for about 5 days? 3. Any good recommendations on where to stay, in terms of convenience to ski slopes, a little English-speaking (if possible) and good value for money. 4. Any idea how much lift passes would be in March? We basically want to ski lots so as to improve as much as possible this trip. Oh, and eat yummy Japanese food too!!! Thanks so much everyone! Link to post Share on other sites
Slippery Jim 65 Posted August 21, 2012 Share Posted August 21, 2012 All three of those would be good choices, along with Shiga Kogen. From your self-description I'd suggest Myoko, but hard to go wrong in March with any of them. Check out the Places to Stay section of the main SnowJapan.com site. Lift pass prices don't change much until very late in the season. Link to post Share on other sites
ippy 66 Posted August 21, 2012 Share Posted August 21, 2012 march is a crap shoot. Youll either get lucky or you wont. Suginohara (one of myoko mountains) is utter garage in crappy conditions after you get past the half way point. Its super flat and rolls into the stickiest nastiest slush. Akakan (myoko) is pretty much the same. Half of the mountain is alright, the rest is going to be slooooooooow. Akakura onsen is garbage either way. And ikenotaira... i kinda liked ikenotaira in truth. In crappy conditions actually its possibly the one par of the montain that might be decent fun. It also has some nice relatively open lift runs and some wide spaced trees if you want to tease the off piste/slackcountry a bit. Its where i took my baby steps into the offpiste in my second season. Shiga kogen should have decent runs still going, i dunno about its off piste (ill be exploring that this year i hope), but the groomers should be alright and in decent condition thanks to the elevation. Hakuba should also have decent condition groomers. A few bits might be breaking through if its a barren couple of weeks but other than that i cant see the groomers being an issue. Plus i always hold up goryu/47 as one of the best intermediate areas REGARDLESS of the conditions. Its just a great place to ride with lots to do for all levels. Plus the panorama is really quite stunning. Nozawa. Nozawa surprised me at around late march this year. The bottom was slushy as youd expect, but the conditions at the very top of yamabiko were STUNNING. Still fluffy, still untracked, and still rocking it. Its kinda small if you stick in that area alone mind you, but if youre powder starved, id consider it. Basically in terms of the conditions sucking, id say the best of the lot for a short trip is going to be Goryu/47 to be honest. Its just got great terrain. If the conditions are great it rocks, but if its poor it still rocks. Myoko on the other hand gets PUKED ON when its good, and has an awesome off piste policy with some really fun tree runs, but when conditions are poor it does kinda make it a little slow and lame. Really id say myoko should be hit in january/february to really see what its about. Nozawa... tough one. In great conditions almost all the red and black runs become easily accessible. BUT teh flats become atrocious to ride without continual unclipping. Once teh snow stops though, all the black runs get moguled to crap turning them into MECHA black diamonds, but the paths and flats become alright to ride with lots of little side walls to play on. The top retains a lot of its consistency too. Basically nozawa needs a nice solid powder run to tie it together and stop that almost mutually exclusive state of affairs regarding its flats, but thats utterly inaccessible to anyone who doesnt like the idea of risking their neck a bit. I do love the skyline though... but it is just point board down and rip. Finally shiga kogen. Only been there the once. Spent most of my time on the groomers because the off piste was pretty much inaccessible at the time (no coverage so really thick trees and scrub for the most part). But the groomers were all well maintained and ther was just enough pitch to it to keep it from being slow and sluggish. Id like to have a pop at it in some powder though just to check out the difference. People love the place, i thought it was kinda alright. If you arent TOTALLY committed to nagano though, Kagura and Naeba (Yuzawa) would also be great choices. Plus, around then youll find the top of kagura nw opened which gives some seriously fun lines (though maybe a bit tough for those first couple of days). Though i think naeba is more fun in crappy conditions. But because theyre so close, if you get lucky and it drops you can pop to kagura, and if it sucks, get the dragondola over to naeba. They really do balance each other out so astonishingly well. Link to post Share on other sites
Mick Rich 78 Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 As Ippy says, March is a riskier month in terms of snowfall so, if you have the choice, go earlier in the month rather than later! I've not yet been to Nozawa or Myoko but went to Hakuba (Goryu/47) twice in March and was lucky enough to have (+1 foot) powder days on 2 of my 3 days there. I would also suggest Kagura/Naeba as another good choice. Good luck with it all! Link to post Share on other sites
Slippery Jim 65 Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 Uh, guys, which part of -- mid-40s couple, 7-year-old, first & second-ever ski trips -- did you miss? Link to post Share on other sites
ippy 66 Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 im going to suggest none of it. I recommended goryu not for its night life or its awesome park, but because its got decent intermediate terrain catering to almost all levels (except maybe advanced) that wont be any less interesting to ride even if the conditions suck (as they often do in march). I didnt recommend myoko because its very much an area thats contingent on its snow. Its also really known for its off piste rather than its trails. If you follow the piste itself, objectively its nice, but not that awesome. And the two strongest areas (suginohara and akakan) both suffer from a bottom half that gets SUPER sticky and slow in wetter/melt conditions. Which of course theres a decent chance of getting in mid march. Nozawa is fun, but again its kinda contingent on the conditions because it has that massive break in the fall line. If the temps remain low but no real drops, then the paths come into their own, whilst the steeps become impassable for a lot of boarders (SERIOUS moguls), whilst the top will be nice and fun. Yet, if its wet, the flats get slow, the moguls are still pretty much packed in none the less but teh tops alright. And if it dumps, lots to access and play on but again, for a burgeoning intermediate theres not much in teh way of OBJECTIVE intermediate riding. I really dont think its a great ride for intermediates to be honest. Shiga kogen is fine regardless of the conditions because you have so many faces (well, three... or 5 if you ski), which gives you a decent chance of finding good quality snow somewhere, and it is HUGE (for japan). Its also high elevation which means freshies stay fresh for longer (whereas on lower elevation areas, you might get a nice dump on the day you arrive, but often by day 2 itll be getting slower and sludgier rather surprisingly quick). So really im focussing on the time of year, the level theyre talking about and the best place to go for when the conditions might be mixed so they can enjoy their time. And for me, the best place is pretty much goryu/47 or naeba. Both are great mountains just to ride on regardless of teh conditions. Neithers perfect, but its a better choice than myoko if only because youre pretty much putting all your eggs in one basket there. If the conditions suck, suginohara and akakan get a little dull is all. And theres a decent chance teh conditions might suck around then. I mean we arent talking april suckage, but it can get slushier and slow faster than youd hope. My 2009 season last ride at myoko was complete zero visibility up top, and treacle at the bottom. It was early march. When it gets crappy, i really wouldnt go there. (In fact since they took away the MOST IMPORTANT LIFT ON THE WHOLE OF SUGINOHARA (after the gondola), they killed that gorgeous long fun varied run in mitahara and in teh process created a bottleneck at the gondola. It really bothered me that they did that. It used to feel so empty and spaced out. Now it feels like its uber busy even though id wager it gets the same numbers. :|) Ehem... i mean er... well you know. Suginohara is gorgeous. Its fun to ride, but honestly if youre seeing it in march, youre not seeing it at its best. Same with akakan. You want it to be puking when you go to myoko. It was absolutely storming down the very first time i went and i loved it so much i immediately went and bought my season pass for it. Great place, i have huge love for it, i just dont think its that good after the peak. I think akakan has a bit of terrain up top, but again a lot of that is tree riding and not really the groomers. The groomers are kinda nowt special to be honest there. I mean they aint bad... they just aint that interesting, and assuming exactly that you arent slackcountry riding thats exactly why id recommend goryu/47 over it. Its just objectively more interesting as a resort for a burgeoning intermediate (when one doesnt account for conditions or off piste). It also gives you great access to several other resorts to chop it up a bit. Link to post Share on other sites
Mick Rich 78 Posted August 23, 2012 Share Posted August 23, 2012 Like ippy said but, errrr, in a few hundred less words! I suggested Goryu/47 as I reckon it fits their bill, with the bottom of Goryu in particular being great for beginners, plus there's plenty of English-speaking, family-friendly accommodation/restaurant options nearby and of course, the other resorts in the Hakuba valley they can explore during their 5 days, if they fancy a change of scene. Link to post Share on other sites
Slippery Jim 65 Posted August 23, 2012 Share Posted August 23, 2012 Definitely agree Goryu would be a fine choice, just think Myoko better for people that new to skiing (YMMV). Doubt they'd enjoy a foot of ungroomed new snow very much. Been to Myoko many a time in early March and never seen it particularly bad, tho no doubt it can happen. Can't honestly recommend Naeba for relative beginners, think that's quite a stretch. Link to post Share on other sites
muikabochi 208 Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 4. Any idea how much lift passes would be in March? The same or a bit less - depending on if they have a "spring ski" rate and when that starts. All depends on the skijo. I also would not recommend Naeba for beginners. Or Kagura. The perfect beginner skijo in Yuzawa region is Iwappara, though the snow would be less good than up at Kagura of course. Link to post Share on other sites
Metabo Oyaji 71 Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 I'm going to jump in here and propose Grandeco in Fukushima. Not just because I'm temperamentally inclined to root for the Fukushima team, but for the beginner-to-intermediate, family-oriented, slope-side accomodation (to make life easy with 7-year-old) with good-snow-in-March requirements. I had my best powder day ever there in March this year. Take the gondola up, and you can take a 3 km beginner course, or a 2 km intermediate course (with some expert side bits available if you want) to the bottom. Take the side lifts to the top for more intermediate-expert runs as desired. Stay at the Hotel Grandeco for ski-in/ski-out (a bit pricy), or stay at a local pension, or, for the budget traveller, stay at the Hotel Listel in Inawashiro (condominium style rooms, straight '80s vibe, but with access to open-air onsen) and use their free shuttle to Grandeco. Now, Grandeco is a bit on the small side, so for 5-6 days straight could be a bit confining. If need be, branch out to the nearby Nekoma (which will also have good snow in March, though doesn't cater as much to beginner-intermediates), Inawashiro, Minowa and other local ski areas. Just a thought. Link to post Share on other sites
Slippery Jim 65 Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 Sure. As is the Club Med at Sahoro, or Furano, or Rusutsu, Nanae, Appi, Shizukuishi, Zao, Iwakura, Sugadaira, Shiga, Ontake...but that wasn't the question. Hi everyone! Really appreciate some help on deciding where to go for our next ski trip in Mar 2013. Considering1. Nozawa Onsen 2. Myoko Kogen 3. Hakuba Link to post Share on other sites
Error404 0 Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 It was ever so naughty of you to stray from the original question Metabo. Please do make sure you don't ever do that again. I don't mean it! Link to post Share on other sites
Metabo Oyaji 71 Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 Consider me appropriately chastened. Link to post Share on other sites
bunnyhopp 0 Posted September 4, 2012 Author Share Posted September 4, 2012 Hi ! Thanks everyone (particularly Ippy) for all the input- certainly very useful information that I can't get anywhere else from the internet! Much appreciated! Sorry for the late post I think we've decided on Hakuba, 47/Goryu and will do Myoko on another trip. Kid has school holidays from 9 March to 17 March, so the date can't be changed. The thing is, we've been talking so much abt our previous ski trips to Japan, that 2 or 3 families are now interested to come with us in March. Adults and kids (from 6-8yrs), mainly first-timers! So it's fallen upon me to plan this unforgettable trip for everyone! We love Japan and our previous trips have been wonderful, and would like our family and friends to have a fantastic time too! Now that we have a bigger group, half of which are kids and first time skiiers, what is a better choice? Stay close to Sakka lifts (Happo-one)- heard that that's a good place for beginners to learn or in one of the pensions along the free shuttle bus route, that takes us to Goryu/47. Any input on Iwatake and Tsugaike? Read that its has good beginner's run too! Thanks in advance! Link to post Share on other sites
iiyamadude 6 Posted September 4, 2012 Share Posted September 4, 2012 Tsugaike is pretty much the best place for beginners in that area region. Get your friends on here too! Link to post Share on other sites
2pints-mate 0 Posted September 4, 2012 Share Posted September 4, 2012 Had to push myself along at the bottom there very wide and open Link to post Share on other sites
Chriselle 158 Posted September 4, 2012 Share Posted September 4, 2012 Sakka is a good place to start and a good area to stay. The little kids zone is great for the young-uns. Once you get familiar on the bunny runs you can take the quad up to more challenging terrain.....with the option of an easy out trail all the way back down to Sakka if anyone in your party doesn't feel up to it. As for Goyru/47....stick to the Goyru side. 47 is not for beginners. Link to post Share on other sites
ippy 66 Posted September 4, 2012 Share Posted September 4, 2012 As far as goryu/47 is concerned... IImori on goryu is awesome. Its where i learned almost every single fundamental for my ride. I rode my first box there. I started carving there. I did my first butters there. I even did my first jumps there. (full disclosure, half of those happened at toomi... but iimori is just utterly empty compared to toomi (and is right next to it), so it gets the credit). Just get the toomi quad up, then cut across toomi skiers left and VOILA! its suddenly empty and EXACTLY the same damn terrain as toomi. No lift queues, no dodging people, and a nice solid gradient to keep you moving without it feeling overwhelming (it also extends further down the hill into possibly the softest gradient on the mountain). Also for a beginner its just about the ideal length so you dont get too exhausted, and so you can lap it and start getting a measure of yoru progression... oh, and because all the other beginners are at toomi, you get to fall off the lift and not feel (too much) like an idiot. I do sort of kind of second the advice against 47 for beginners. I would temper it though by pointing out that once you can link your turns or hold a decent line on skis noobies MUST ride the panorama course. Its breathtaking and will be one of those views that they will carry with them to the grave. It is a path though so obviously its better if you go after youve done a few days and not piss off everyone riding behind you (a great deal of whom are likely to be beginners themselves). What else, oh yeah, another reason is obviously now you can dump all those kids at a ski school and have done with it. Im pretty sure there are a few english speaking classes on goryu (dont hold me to it, but im fairly certain), so thats job done. ETA: Apparently i wrote a review on goryu http://www.snowjapanforums.com/index.php/blog/11/entry-22-hakuba-goryu47-for-the-uninitiated/ Link to post Share on other sites
HelperElfMissy 42 Posted September 4, 2012 Share Posted September 4, 2012 Agree with Ippy about getting onto Panorama if you are up to it. Outstanding views, breathtaking really. 47 certainly is a bit tough going for beginners though. We loved Iwatake. Cruisey runs, family atmosphere and low pressure on a day with more white out than not. Link to post Share on other sites
Slippery Jim 65 Posted September 4, 2012 Share Posted September 4, 2012 +1 on Goryu, Bunnyhop. Hope you have a great time. Link to post Share on other sites
Error404 0 Posted September 6, 2012 Share Posted September 6, 2012 Going back to one of your comments bunny, I would definitely do "somewhere else" other than Happo for beginner stuff. Link to post Share on other sites
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