Cameronandcaron 0 Posted August 12, 2012 Author Share Posted August 12, 2012 Ok... one and only one more question .... I can get my hands on a set of Dynastar Outland 80 Skis, 5m @ 152cm, 126/80/110 ... very good price.. from what I've read I can't find anything negative and it seems to press all the buttons... Is a five mm smaller waist difference going to make a difference on the wear and tear on my knees and the snowy slopes of Japan...? Link to post Share on other sites
FISS 1 Posted August 12, 2012 Share Posted August 12, 2012 The dynastar outland 80 has received some pretty good reviews from American users. It looks like a good ski. Is it the 152cm that you can get cheap? If so it is probably a little short for you, it maybe OK for your wife in that length though. 5mm less width is going to make it easier to turn and quicker response edge to edge but you will lose some of the floatation provided by the slightly fatter ski. Every ski you buy will be a compromise.... there is no such thing as a ski that is perfect for all conditions. It's about finding the one that is the closest fit to what you want from it and the price you want to pay. Link to post Share on other sites
FISS 1 Posted August 13, 2012 Share Posted August 13, 2012 Went to one of the local ski shops today to have a proper look at the Dynastar outland 80 but they only had the outland 75. The outland 75 would definitely be more suited to groomed runs, with the extra width of the outland 80 it should be better off piste than the ski I looked at. The 75 seems to not be too stiff and I am guessing there won't be too much difference between it and the 80, I think the ski will be reasonably easy to turn and feel good at lower to normal speeds but will not feel so good if you ski really fast on it. Link to post Share on other sites
Cameronandcaron 0 Posted August 13, 2012 Author Share Posted August 13, 2012 Fiss thanks for the replies ... the Dynastar length was a typo .. they are 171cm not 152... (for me not wife) Well it has finally come down to two ski's...... I can get a set of Head All Mountain Peak 84 Ski W/Bindings Peak 84 Pro All Mountain Dimensions 15.4m @ 128/84/112, 171 cm length (NEW) for $550 in Australia. Very, very good price. or Dynastar Outland 80 Skis,15m @ 172cm, 126/80/110. Delivered to Aus for about $50 cheaper. Thanks to everyone .... for your thoughts and input... especially FISS and MikePow ... it is appreciated.... Link to post Share on other sites
Mike Pow 52 Posted August 13, 2012 Share Posted August 13, 2012 You're more than welcome. If you intend spending more time on the groomed runs then the Dynastar is my recommendation. My student and ski partner Ian MacKenzie skied on the Dynastar Sultan last winter. Same profile as the Outland. He loved them. If you feel you'd like to explore a bit more then the wider platform of the Peak 84 is the go. I'm on Head skis at the moment (Head Supershape Magnum 121-71-107 in a 170 cm length) and they're excellent. You won't go wrong with either. Link to post Share on other sites
greg 4 Posted August 15, 2012 Share Posted August 15, 2012 I would just ask you to think what you really intend to do? I know you have already stated it but you should really think about it. If you are going all the way to Japan what are you after? the groomed runs or the powder? You have recieved heaps of good advice on skis and it's all personal preference. Just pick something that will compliment your Japan experience. You may find you will spend more time in the powder than you expect! Link to post Share on other sites
Chriselle 158 Posted August 15, 2012 Share Posted August 15, 2012 I agree with Mitch. I ski a Rossignol S3 (98 waist) most of the time and it's a perfect ski for pretty much any conditions. Link to post Share on other sites
Cameronandcaron 0 Posted August 15, 2012 Author Share Posted August 15, 2012 Hi there Gtrain / Chriselle ... thanks for the responses... The primary area of play will be groomed runs... Just some background .. i'm 50yrs and have been beating my knees up for a long, long time .. football .. fighting .. etc ... As much as the allure of smashing it off piste is tempting i'm cognizant of managing my knees wear and tear. Playing under the controlled conditions of groomed runs will extend my knee life considerably. I know that if I get a set of powder skis i'll end up playing off piste all the time and probably lower my long term skiing prospects ... ( sucks getting older.. you just learn to play smarter ) Off piste - most likely a shorter skiing career albeit probably a touch more exciting... on piste - hopefully another 20 years without destroying my knees ( or until I don't need them anymore) Hence the narrower skis .... and hopefully less wear and tear... I also figured that if I wanted to play off - piste for a day i'd just rent for the day... Well that's the theory anyway ..... time will tell... Link to post Share on other sites
Chriselle 158 Posted August 15, 2012 Share Posted August 15, 2012 Your theory is kind of dated.....and I used to ski long and skinny 205 Atomic race skiis back in the day. Things have changed..... I'm 46 and have beat up knees and everything else for that matter and I still prefer a wider ski. I have some nice Atomic carvers, a set of all mountain Harts, and the S3's. Hands down the S3's are my farorites even on groomers and since I usually ski alone I don't get off piste all that much. And you don't have to go on an adventure to find powder either in Japan. Epic first funs on piste are a pretty regular thing. I'm not making a case for the real fatties.....(I'm not into those) but a mid size waist of up to around 100 is a great all round forgiving, fun and versatile ski. Link to post Share on other sites
Jimmer 2 Posted August 15, 2012 Share Posted August 15, 2012 70-80mm underfoot is ideal if all you want to do is ski on piste. As an intermediate any fatter will make it harder for you to learn to use your edges properly, yes you will find it easier to ski powder (and yes you will probably find powder on piste in Japan), but all you'll probably be doing is pushing your tails out, with a flat ski, which isn't great technique and is hard work too. Link to post Share on other sites
FISS 1 Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 Hi Cameronandcaron, you are most welcome. I have to say that I am on the same page as MikePow, it is obvious from the information he gives that he is both knowledgeable and in the ski industry. The Head Supershape he is on is an excellent ski and would definitely be also worth a look. It is a ski that ticks so many boxes, it is a ski that anyone from high intermediate to expert can get something from and ski anywhere on the mountain. If anyone says it can't be skied well both on and off trail I would urge them to watch Richie Berger on the internet. He rips on them. It is the best ski mentioned so far but you will need to be more precise on it off piste than some of the other skis you've mentioned. In regard to some of the later posts fatter skis create more leverage trying to get the ski flat and hence more forces on the knees. This won't be a problem if you are only skiing soft snow or mainly ski with a flat ski and don't really use your edges, but I wouldn't suggest buying a 100mm ski and skiing them for everything. I had 6 weeks in colorado a few years ago and only took 2 pairs of skis (slalom & fat powder skis). It was a really bad season for snow and I obliterated my slalom skis on a rock and had to spend the last 3 weeks skiing on hard groomers on the powder skis. I was fine at first but after a couple of weeks my knees were killing me. I got to the point where I was only able to do one run a day because it was so excruciating. The good news is that a couple of weeks rest and I was back to normal so no permanent damage done, but if you have issues with your knees don't ski hard snow on super fat skis! Fat skis are designed for soft snow and that's where they work best. Narrow race skis are designed for hard icy race courses and that's where they work best. It's about getting the right compromise for you and as I mentioned earlier MikePow seems on the money to me. Jimmers comments are valid too Link to post Share on other sites
Cameronandcaron 0 Posted August 18, 2012 Author Share Posted August 18, 2012 Guys thanks to everyone ... for all your thoughts and opinions... I think the experienced opinions and thoughts come through and you see those validated by others, not only on here but through general research on the net. I think a site like this is an exceptional resource for gaining real world opinions from those who should know... keep it up ... I'm sure I won't be the last asking these questions .... Link to post Share on other sites
rider69 18 Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 LOL mike pow doesnt ride fat skis in the pow though. I ride anywhere from 135mm to 114 mm waist skis. The wider they are the more you will float. I would leave your skis at home and just rent from a shop that lets you trade in your skis on a daily basis. If you are going to continue to come to Japan then consider buying something. Link to post Share on other sites
Mike Pow 52 Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 Very true rider69, I don't. But the original poster has made it clear that he's looking for an all mountain ski that will be used primarily on piste. Link to post Share on other sites
Slippery Jim 65 Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 Careful Mike, referencing the OP's question can arouse anger in these wilds Link to post Share on other sites
pie-eater 207 Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 Careful, rider69, not following the rules as laid down by original poster may well also have similar effect! Link to post Share on other sites
Mike Pow 52 Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 Careful Mike, referencing the OP's question can arouse anger in these wilds ha ha Link to post Share on other sites
rider69 18 Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 Whats the point he pretty much owns an all mountain ski. Rent as you need depending on snow depth. Link to post Share on other sites
Mike Pow 52 Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 Original post My wife and I are heading to Rusutsu and Furano in February... We have our own boots but are looking to buy skis . He and his wife are not looking to spend the majority of their time off the groomed runs and in the powder. Hence my advice on purchasing an all-mountain ski that will be better suited to groomed piste, fresh snow and crud on groomed piste, and bumps. A ski with a waist width 114mm + is not the tool for the job IMHO. Link to post Share on other sites
rider69 18 Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 Again if they have no idea it is much better to rent. the choices out there are pretty much endless. Renting is the best option that will lead to buying the right ski. Link to post Share on other sites
Mike Pow 52 Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 Do you work in the rental industry rider69? Only asking as one of my customers had the same advice and experience last winter. I had taught her for two days and recommended she change the ski she was on. From a powder ski to an all-mountain ski. I went to the largest rental shop in Niseko to see what skis were available in the fleet. I picked out an all-mountain ski for her and passed that information on to her. She then went in with her boot to have the bindings sized and came away with a 110mm under foot powder ski recommended to her by the person working in the shop who had never seen her ski and who hadn't listened to what she had asked for. Throughout this thread the original poster has informed us that he and his wife want to buy skis they're going to Furano and Rusutsu they're looking to ski on intermediate level slopes they're planning on spending the bulk of their time on the groomed runs Link to post Share on other sites
Chriselle 158 Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 I agree with you MikePow....110 to 114 is a little overkill. I do think between 90 and 100 is a great ski though. Link to post Share on other sites
Mike Pow 52 Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 I agree with you MikePow....110 to 114 is a little overkill. I do think between 90 and 100 is a great ski though. Definitely. TBH there aren't any bad skis out there these days. Some are just better suited to some ability levels more than others. Some are just better suited to some terrain and snow conditions more than others. If people are having fun skiing on 90+ waist width skis on and off the groomed runs, then fantastic. Just offering up my opinion on what I think the OP and his wife will enjoy the most based on their age, ability, and aims. Link to post Share on other sites
rider69 18 Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 There are so many factors these days when selecting a ski. You have tip rocker, tail rocker, full rocker. stiff tail soft tail, slight camber to full camber. I stand by the comment that renting with the option of being able to try many skis is a very viable option. Most rental shops dealing with people from abroad will allow people to change as they please. Am I connected to the industry yes I am. Am I connected to a rental shop no im not. I have a small contract with Nordica boots and skis to help demo their products. I also have a small relationship with down skis out of Swiss also demoing and brand recognition. I taught skiing for 7 years before moving onto more free riding. I get to handle more skis per season by different brands than anyone I know. That is anyone I know. Does this make me an expert no but I hope this shows that I do no a little about what I am talking about. Link to post Share on other sites
Mike Pow 52 Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 There are so many factors these days when selecting a ski. You have tip rocker, tail rocker, full rocker. stiff tail soft tail, slight camber to full camber. Yep and therein lies the problem. Sifting through the marketing and hype from the ski manufacturers. I stand by the comment that renting with the option of being able to try many skis is a very viable option. Most rental shops dealing with people from abroad will allow people to change as they please. And it's an option that I heartily recommend too. However the OP was pretty specific in his posts - he's looking to buy a piste oriented ski to ski in Rusutsu and Furano. Am I connected to the industry yes I am. Am I connected to a rental shop no im not. I have a small contract with Nordica boots and skis to help demo their products. I also have a small relationship with down skis out of Swiss also demoing and brand recognition. I taught skiing for 7 years before moving onto more free riding. I get to handle more skis per season by different brands than anyone I know. That is anyone I know. Does this make me an expert no but I hope this shows that I do no a little about what I am talking about. That was never in doubt and never questioned by me at least. Link to post Share on other sites
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