Just made an important discovery!

[mitchpee 10]

So I have always been fascinated by how so many people are led by Joseph Smith as a prophet. After tons of research on the subject (read many books about the life of him and research historians analysis of his life) and have come to the conclusion that the most likely scenario is that Joseph Smith ingested a hallucinogenary plant that allowed him to see "god and his son".

 

So this is where the discovery comes in. The most likely plant he ingested is called "datura" and it is found commonly throughout the US. It is VERY dangerous and just a bit too much can easily kill someone and cause severe neurological damage. Here's the wiki article about the plant:

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Datura

 

So I am wondering, eat the plant and create my own crazy religion to convert millions of followers worldwide? Haha obviously this is a joke as I have no desire to eat a plant that makes you feel like crap for 4-5 days but it's quite an interesting find indeed, may be boring to all of you who have never met a mormon though! Food for thought.

[RobBright 35]

Or perhaps find a new strain of antibiotics.

 

That would be an important discovery.

[Go Native 70]

Or a strain of something that just kills off Mormons! Now that would be of great benefit to the world

[bobby12 0]

Now I remember why I dont eat random plants off the ground.

[Mintyjulep 0]

Datura is also the hallucinogenic used in Jean M Auels series by neanderthal shamans.

 

You could start a cult of hairy men and tell them they are neanderthals and they need to reclaim their world.

[Thundercat 60]

Joseph Smith, the con artist who four years before 'founding' the Mormon church was arrested and convicted of fraud for selling fake gold claims. Who cares what he ate.

 

http://vimeo.com/974787

[Jynxx 4]

Datura, (commonly called Jimson weed in the States), (Asagao-mornimg face in Japan) has been used by Australian Aboriginies. It is also one of the ingredients used by sourcerers in Carlos Castanada´s books.

Highly toxic and potent, the Aborigines soak them in water for weeks and boil them to leech out the excess.

An aquaitence of mine one night went out and ate it straight and ended up in the mental hospital. Manic depressant after that.

[Thundercat 60]

Hey Jynxx, Asagao is actually Morning Glory in English. Ingesting it's seeds can also induce hallucinations.

 

I studied botany some years ago and became really interested in the datura plant. In fact I did a really extensive study on it... we even named our band Datura Dream Deferred because I found it so interesting...

 

Datura Stramonium, (the variety known as Jimson weed or Jamestown weed) is quite a common plant to find in backyard gardens in Canada because of it's beautiful trumpet flowers. Most people probably have no idea how dangerous it can be...

[Jynxx 4]

Originally Posted By: Black Mountain

Hey Jynxx, Asagao is actually Morning Glory in English.

Ofcourse

and it's not Datura. I think that's called Hiru-Gao in Japanese.

[RobBright 35]

Datura in japanese is ãƒãƒ§ã‚¦ã‚»ãƒ³ã‚¢ã‚µã‚¬ã‚ªå±ž

[Jynxx 4]

Korean Morning Glory family

first time I heard the term

[Jynxx 4]

Calling Korea ãƒãƒ§ã‚¦ã‚»ãƒ³ is considered by some to be a offensive.

We say Kan-Koku these days.

[RobBright 35]

chousen and kan-koku are different places now.

 

we say chousen is north korea and kan-koku is south korea.

[gerard 6]

Interesting. I clicked on a footnote from the wikipedia article and found this from the Pacific School of Herbal Medicine:

http://www.pshm.org/datura_poisoning.shtml

Interesting read from the second half and touches on some heavy related issues. Actually I'll just paste it in here:

Quote:

There are broader issues here. Why are people, completely outside of appropriate cultural context, ingesting datura seeds for fun or enlightenment? It never provides the former, nor the latter for those without appropriate guidance from within the few Native American cultures that still use datura seeds ceremonially. (If some one offering to let you pay them for a workshop on multi-culti shamanism offers to guide you through a datura seed 'vision quest' simply ask them how to say "datura seed" or "huckster" in Tungus as you quickly leave.) Why are mainstream herbalists often unable to offer care and education regarding datura poisoning?

 

Mainstream herbalists could and should be more vocal in our denouncement of pseudo-Native American sham artists like Carlos Castaneda and romantic entheogen enthusiasts that popularize datura ingestion. They confuse the narrow and injudicious use of psychoactive plants for the richness of traditional medicine, with its cultural and geographic basis, religious roots, and depth of biological understanding. Nor do they understand the role of traditional medicine in First Nation people's survival.

 

The common romantic enthusiasm amongst nonnative people for all things Indian, especially spirituality, is usually indicative not only of personal pain and confusion, but also of a personal and cultural lack of historicity, as well as an unexamined sense of entitlement that rests on white supremacist and colonial privilege. This romantic fascination, besides being a waste of time, is harmful to both those who hold it and those objectified by it.

 

Mainstream herbalists in our role as practitioners need to be able to offer care and guidance to people suffering from datura poisoning. As teachers, we should be educating about broader issues of cultural misappropriation, racism in healthcare and healthcare education, and spiritual abuse. To do this mainstream herbalists will need to confront colonialism and racism within themselves as individuals, amongst their peers, and as a professional class within our institutions. Unfortunately, many mainstream herbalists are too busy taking LSD or ayahuasca between ethnobotany courses, setting themselves up as spiritual leaders at no ones' request, and longing for the simpler days when Jerry Garcia was still alive...

 

Spiritual self-importance, a common problem in the mainstream herbal scene in the United States, gets in the way of cultural humility, cultural competence and the delivery of competent healthcare. We are no different from the dominant culture, because, good intentions aside, we are the dominant culture. Lack of critical awareness and self-critique on these issues does lead to pain and suffering for all parties involved.

[Jynxx 4]

Interesting point, but it does infringe on the boarder of CHOICE. But the bigger issue is, is culture or ceremony the sole domain and fall under the ownership and claims of authenticity by so called native culture? In this case, says American native.

Were I am coming from relates to people claiming that the EAST is spiritual than the WEST back in the early ´80s. I don´t understand the meaning of cultural appropriatiom, assimilation because I see some common roots and values that they share in the past. What I see is more of the difference in the change of our values between past and present.

And no ones business to criricise those that are experimenting and being on the search. You can turn the table and say `Because one is living in a so called primitive and native way. you shouldn´t appropriate modern ways like taking Western medicine and recreation ...´

Also the notion of being romantic. Wasn´t the idea of New Age movement had in its foundation that we have lost some ancient ritual and knowledge that teaches us we have a larger potential in this physical and material reality?

 

[gerard 6]

I had a feeling you'd get in on this one, Jynxx.

 

.........Yeah, something like that.... I don't know. My reading of it, anyway is that New Ageism and trying to get in touch with our Indian roots and the whole psychedelic thang etc. etc. is cheesy fluff for white kids who are trying to fill some kind of deficit in their lives. Fair enough imo, but the whole quest for something deeper is all very superficial and this apparent reverence for 'primitive' cultural stuff really just plays into stereotypes and is quite condescending in a way and doesn't really scratch the surface for the most part, and that doesn't really benefit either culture.

 

But hell, it's all part of growing up, eh?