klingon 10 Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 Originally Posted By: Go Native Originally Posted By: klingon They just see potential $. It's the way of the world sadly. Yeah all those evil, bad businesses attempting to stay in business! So sad... Nicely taken out of context. Link to post Share on other sites
Tex 3 Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 AHH a healthy debate "SPAM is unsolicited bulk e-mail sent to indiscriminate (and numerous) recipients..." It MIGHT include unsolicited commercial e-mails, but if you have provided an e-mail address it probably doesn't rate as indiscriminate. I find it annoying to the extent that I have to delete it or register the domain as junk etc and my mouse index finger can get a cramp if I have not warmed up and stretched correctly. I would prefer not to get it, but sifting through to unsub (while probably the prudent thing to do in the long run) is something I never do because in many cases it does nothing except flag your address as someone who is taking at least a little bit of interest in the content. What I can not fathom is those in marketing and advertising (and I don't mean you GN as I know a few personally) trying to guild the lilly. Sure it gets results, that's good for business and them, but for many people it is at least an annoyance or PITA of differing dimensions. It would never stop me using a particular company though... Link to post Share on other sites
Go Native 70 Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 Tex I'm the same as you basically. I sometimes find it a little annoying to suddenly be getting all these promotional emails just because I enquired about or bought a product but it's not something I get all that worked up about and it wouldn't stop me from buying something from them again if the price is right. It's really not that hard to set a domain as junk mail if you want it stopped. The completely unsolicited spam from the Viagra pushers does annoy me more as you can never seem to stop it no matter what you do and believe me I have yet to enquire about or bought any Believe me if we received a lot of complaints about our newsletters then we would definitely rethink our current strategy but we get virtually none. Link to post Share on other sites
iiyamadude 6 Posted January 2, 2010 Author Share Posted January 2, 2010 Just continue being ignorant to some of the issues then. Link to post Share on other sites
Go Native 70 Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 Have not denied the issue you've raised can be annoying. The question for those of us who use such marketing is whether there's a benefit to the business. In our experienced there most definitely is. It's that simple, the benefits outweigh any possible downsides for us. Link to post Share on other sites
iiyamadude 6 Posted January 2, 2010 Author Share Posted January 2, 2010 But the whole thing here is that you seem to be almost totally denying the extent of the 'possible downsides for you' and have shown no way of measuring and really knowing such downsides. I'm sure you'll come back with more of the same, but whatever, I'm out. Link to post Share on other sites
Go Native 70 Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 I've already explained we can easily monitor how many people reply to newsletters and e-blasts. We can also monitor how many of the replies turn into actual sales. For marketing that basically costs us nothing the returns are better than pretty much all other forms of marketing we have. I've not denied possible downsides I've just pointed out that they, as far as we can tell, are nowhere near outweighed by the benefits. Just because there's something that you find annoying doesn't mean it's not effective. I find television advertising very annoying and it's probably not very effective on me but companies worldwide spend billions of dollars on it because it is very damned effective. Link to post Share on other sites
HelperElfMissy 42 Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 There are always upsides and downsides. No matter what you do. If the upsides well outweigh the downsides, then usually the decision is to GO FOR IT. Personally - I am on the mailing lists of a number of snow related companies - including accommodation providers in Hokkaido. Occasionally I get an email and I have many other things to attend to, the content is not rocking my world and I just ignore it. But generally I actually have a gander. I have purchased/booked and contacted businesses as a direct result of this marketing. But I don't see it as SPAM. Yes I was added to these lists (ALL OF THEM) without requesting it, however I have either made contact, or used services/purchased goods from those providers previously. I want to see what latest offers and deals they have. I want to see what property is newly listed in Thredbo. I want to get an update about the latest Karaoke CDG sellout. I want to hear about the latest BUFF innovation. I want to hear when Ice Skates are on sale next. I want to know when my favorite accommodation provider has a new service that they are offering us. if I didn't I would scan the email for an opt out link and say "Yeah...no thanks". It's not hard really. Link to post Share on other sites
7-11 2 Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 What if every email you sent and every company you contacted put you on a mailing list? You obviously really want that info Mamabear. That seems fine with you. But if you don't want to be and you didn't ask to be sent stuff, it is annoying. And asking people to take an action to remove themselves from something they didn't ask to be part of in the first place... what if most things in life worked that way?? It is spam, simple. Link to post Share on other sites
HelperElfMissy 42 Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 Not really 7-11. I wouldn't have thought to ask all those companies to add me to thier mailing lists. But I have actually found them beneficial. Just before a big party I was holding...a karaoke/sushi/sake fundraiser I got a "SPAM email" from the Karaoke Company I use. I had forgotten about them and was just going to use the 1000 or so songs we already had. But a quick scan showed me that for another $80AUD I could get a whole load of current songs to add to the mix. HELLO! Thank you for the SPAM! We have not bought a ski property yet - but we are in the market. I think it will probably be another 2 years before we go serious - but if the right property came up - who knows. We are booking for a ski holiday in the Northern Hemi every year - if we are looking at Vale (which we are next year) and we get an email from a provider in Niseko or Hakuba with an awesome package deal for an early booking - guess what?! Honestly - all it takes to get OFF the mailing list is a simple UNSUBSCRIBE button. I have clicked it a dozen or so times this year for emails from companies I do not wish to hear more from. it takes all of about 30 seconds....much quicker than it would be to source all of the information from the companies that I WANT to hear from if they chose not to add me to their mailing lists automatically. I find unsolicited phone calls asking for donations, offering you pest control or roof coating right on the dinner hour MUCH more annoying. Link to post Share on other sites
Go Native 70 Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 The reason this sort of marketing works very well is because of people like MB. You're awesome MB Link to post Share on other sites
klingon 10 Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 Very possibly will get ignored once again but hey Quote: Many people feel uncomfortable responding to unsubscribe instructions on an email that they haven't signed up for. And for good reason. Quote: ...either not be arsed to click on the unsubscribe and/or not trust it and/or not see it and/or not understand it It's been fun but I have other fun things to do now. Link to post Share on other sites
Go Native 70 Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 Maybe if you increase the font and put it in bold your point will be made that much better klingon Link to post Share on other sites
klingon 10 Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 I was considering doing that, but thought it would get ignored all the same. Don't want to hear it, an' all that. Link to post Share on other sites
HelperElfMissy 42 Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 I hear your point Klingon. I think it is valid. But I also think that email users are becoming more and more savvy and learning to use this as a tool to their benefit. It takes time for people to understand new idea's in anything - marketing is no different. My mother (bless her) sent me a text message the other day "your Nana is in hospital, very unwell. LOL Mum." Once I explained that LOL did not mean Lots of Love she got on the programme. If people have not yet worked out what the unsubscribe button is for - they will soon. This kind of marketing is the way of the future. Embrace or not. like or not. Much easier to work with it than to get the hump with companies. I reckon if you are annoyed at the email - send that unsubscribe IMMEDIATELY - and they will soon get the message. Maybe at their annual review they will be able to crunch the numbers and see that bulk mailing to people who just ask for a quote ends in unsubscribes while bulk mailing of people who have actually booked results in rebookings.... But without people unsubscribing to the email instead of getting all offended by it - how will they know? Link to post Share on other sites
klingon 10 Posted January 3, 2010 Share Posted January 3, 2010 How will they know? Exactly. They do not know. Its one of the main points of this thread isn't it. Anyway my fun awaits. Link to post Share on other sites
RobBright 35 Posted January 3, 2010 Share Posted January 3, 2010 Of those 10,000 people, how many of them have the newsletter marked as spam and sent directly to their spam bin? Link to post Share on other sites
Go Native 70 Posted January 3, 2010 Share Posted January 3, 2010 Who knows and who cares? It's the ones that reply that count... Guess that's the real point in this thread, if you don't like it then you don't have to receive it whether you mark as spam or hit the unsubscribe link. It's not that much of an inconvenience.... Link to post Share on other sites
igloo 3 Posted January 3, 2010 Share Posted January 3, 2010 Here's a good one. I started gettig newsletters from a certain Niseko based company. Funny thing was, I have neve sent an email or sent off a form to the company - ever. There is a tiny unsubscribe link at the bottom of the mail. The first 2 times I clicked it and it took me to their website - nothing about unsubscribing. I suppose with businesses fighting to survive etc, that's ok with some people too. Of course I badmouth them wherever possible when the subject comes up. They might have got a few clicks from me when I tried to unsubscribe, but they sure as hell are getting a lot of badvibed wom. Link to post Share on other sites
igloo 3 Posted January 3, 2010 Share Posted January 3, 2010 Originally Posted By: Go Native Who knows and who cares? It's the ones that reply that count... You are wrong. See my comment above. If you dismiss people taking annoyance of this, then you are the one not being smart. In the long run of course. Link to post Share on other sites
igloo 3 Posted January 3, 2010 Share Posted January 3, 2010 Quote: It's not that much of an inconvenience.... Do you yourself like being inconvenienced by other people? Funny that, I don't. Link to post Share on other sites
Go Native 70 Posted January 3, 2010 Share Posted January 3, 2010 Whatever, all you guys should start your own marketing companies since you think you know the consumer so well Link to post Share on other sites
JA2340 16 Posted January 3, 2010 Share Posted January 3, 2010 Any email I get from someone/company I have not actually requested info from, I tell Mailwasher just the once that it is spam and to bounce the mail (ie send back a message to the effect that the original email couldn't be delivered) then delete it and do this every time there's another email from the same address (or I can set it to do that for all emails from that domain). That way I don't have to click the, sometimes dangerous - as klingon mentioned - "unsubscribe" link - just an indication that the email is live. GN's stats will not see this email as a problem, it will just not turn up as a "unsubscribe", nor will it show up as a further contact. So, using GN's rationale, I'd be seen as a willing recipient. I'm not disputing that these methods generate results. As GN says, people wouldn't do it if it didn't work. That's the trouble with statistics, there is no guarantee that you're measuring the things you think you are. Link to post Share on other sites
igloo 3 Posted January 3, 2010 Share Posted January 3, 2010 Originally Posted By: Go Native Whatever, all you guys should start your own marketing companies since you think you know the consumer so well Is that your cut and paste response when you ain't got anything else to say on the matter? Link to post Share on other sites
JA2340 16 Posted January 3, 2010 Share Posted January 3, 2010 Igloo ... don't go there again. Better not to say anything than to be offensive to someone you may (or may not) know. Link to post Share on other sites
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