Emigration to Australia

[bushpig 0]

Hmmm, nah mejane, you have to bear in mind that in most of the capital cities there are large enough populations to warrant fairly decent facilities in that regard. If you live in the country, then you do have to travel to the cities for some specialized things, but the cities are generally well supplied. My impression is that they are less up to date here in Japan in the medical industry. Of course if you pay the cash and go to Tokyo or one of the other big centers, then you can get the best, but that applies to Aus too.

[bushpig 0]

And I agree with Spook. The perception of the laid-back (perhaps slacker) work ethic in Aus doesn't ring true in my opinion. And from what I hear any hint of that has disappeared even more in the last 20 years or so. Here, people work longer hours, but could get the same work done much quicker. It's a matter of efficiency. I'm basing this only on what I have seen in the school system here. The one company I worked in here was different. People were very busy all day actually working. BPGs company now is the opposite though. In any case, most Aussies I know are quite hard working, but will get out of the office as soon as they can.

[tripitaka 0]

Aussie is now the least affordable place to buy a property in the world. Skiing's not too cheap either!!

 

http://www.news.com.au/business/story/0,23636,23081706-462,00.html

[js 0]

Ditto BP, all the major centres have all the facilities anyone needs. From Hospitals to swimming pools, lots of sports clubs (naturally), etc.

 

Comparing it to Japan or the UK is unfair for many reasons, but I reckon (pound for pound) we compete above our weight.

 

For example, based on the Human Development Index (HDI) we're ranked as number three (1 = Iceland 2 = Norway). And according to the World Bank, we're classified as a 'high income' country.

 

There are significant climate and social differences between our State capitals though - which is a result of geographical isolation and the historical fact that originally they were separate colonies of Britain.

 

So someone may dislike Sydney and assume they will hate the remainder of the country = wrong.

 

You learn quickly when traveling in Oz to keep the tent zipped-up at ALL TIMES. (Anyway, most of the really nasty bities would rather retreat into a hole than attack and bite.)

 

Also, having worked in the Public Service for many years, don't believe it that Council and State employees are slackers - far from it.

[bushpig 0]

Maybe Fossil can chime in here about medical facilities. He is in the industry (I think)

[NoFakie 45]

 Originally Posted By: tripitaka

Aussie is now the least affordable place to buy a property in the world. Skiing's not too cheap either!!

http://www.news.com.au/business/story/0,23636,23081706-462,00.html

The article is only half the story, because it doesn't mention comparative interest rates. For an Aussie mortgage at 8% for 30 years, the interest is over 1.5 times the principal! That means a 400k mortgage will cost you over 1 million!

Tbh, with affordability as high as it is, the most logical direction for prices to go is down. People like to think of their homes as an asset, but with all assets, you shouldn't have all your eggs in one basket.

The yen also looks like it could strengthen this year as uridashi positions unwind, so Bobby and anyone else should consider that before changing major wonga into any currency. Its very volatile at the moment.

[tripitaka 0]

 Originally Posted By: Mr Wiggles

 Originally Posted By: tripitaka

Aussie is now the least affordable place to buy a property in the world. Skiing's not too cheap either!!

http://www.news.com.au/business/story/0,23636,23081706-462,00.html

The article is only half the story, because it doesn't mention comparative interest rates. For an Aussie mortgage at 8% for 30 years, the interest is over 1.5 times the principal! That means a 400k mortgage will cost you over 1 million!

Tbh, with affordability as high as it is, the most logical direction for prices to go is down. People like to think of their homes as an asset, but with all assets, you shouldn't have all your eggs in one basket.

The yen also looks like it could strengthen this year as uridashi positions unwind, so Bobby and anyone else should consider that before changing major wonga into any currency. Its very volatile at the moment.

Why would you even bother buying a house? NZ's just as bad. You would only think it's a matter of time before it all goes belly up, but they've been saying that for years. Judging by the amount of Aussies in Hakuba, people aren't short of money.

[Domokun_72dpi 0]

Ok, this is just MY take on it. So, don't argue, or give me crap cos I won't bite back. Just my rendition, cos I live here.

 

Being short of money is not the issue Trip. We have the problem of inflation, due partly to the fact that people like to spend money.

many people here think "stuff it, i can't buy a house so i'll spend like there's no tomnorrow", putting everything on credit card. The government pushes spending, advertising eggs people to get into debt, credit card company's are pushing their wares, all the while we are pushing up inflation.

 

Chinas need for raw resources have pushed a minig boom in Western Australia that has pushed the cost of living & housing affordability to a stupid dimension.

 

One only needs to look @ Toronta Canada to see what happens. Once a mining boom ends, what is left?, a whole lot of unskilled workers (unskilled in anything different from mining associated), which then leads to unemployment. Kids are dropping out of Uni to cash in on the boom. Toronto Parks is now one of the few "cash cows" that is helping it stay afloat, promoting eco-tourism (something Western Australia really has to adopt now!).

 

The Aussie boom prolly got no more than 7-10 years left, but then again, if the US economy goes under, Australia suffers, as China slows exports to the US< and their need for resounces declines, so it could be before then.

 

Western Australia does not have the infrastructure to house the influx of People, and the Social & Environmental impacts this boom are having are huge.

 

Rich are gettign richer, the poor are getting poorer. Typical scenario. Kids now cannot afford home. if you were lucky to get in before it went stupid, then that is good.

 

It's not all doom & gloom, Australia has so many beautiful places, chances for a good education, good living, eating (ok, not perth for eating), and freedom.

 

$500k house is cheap. Look to Sinfgapore, U can't get a decent 2 bedroom flat under $500k. then again, their government did it right. they allow you to invest into Super, which acts as your mortgage, and with interst rates (I think Mrs Domo said around 1%), it is a very sweet option. So, even if a 2 bedroom flat over there cost you $700k, it's still cheaper than buying a cheaper one here in Australia.

There are still opportunities to buy cheap houses, you just can't be a snob.

 

If you don't buy, what will you do?, rent of some rich jerk? No thanks.

[bobby12 0]

House prices are relative though, and thats why they have kept high in the UK despite everyone saying a crash is coming.

 

For example, my aunt bought her council house in a london suburb for about 80,000 GBP 15 years ago. Now it is worth about 250,000 GBP. Does that make her rich? Not really, if she sells she has to buy another similar house which will also cost 250,000. So she only wins if she leaves and buys a place in Sri Lanka.

 

(start rant)

In the UK, the problem is buy-to-let, I think this is a truly evil scheme. Property investors own all the houses inflating prices. Additionally they butcher houses into crappy little flats. This forces first time buyers to pay over the odds for a house or just become tenants and line their pockets instead. One of the main reasons Im not going back to London is the crazy prices for houses there. I grew up there, have a master degree and good work experience, and yet I cant afford anything there unless I get a tiny flat in a craphole area in the outskirts. The market is so saturated its hard to see prices getting higher there. What is the purpose of a house? A place for someone to live or a way for someone to grab cash? I really think something is wrong with that, but hey thats capitalism.

 

I notice in Oz its the same, all the real estate sites are full of 'perfect for buy-to-let' etc in their ad descriptions. Maybe it will all bust one day and the investors will get burnt, and it'll settle back down to a situation where first time buyers can join the party. I guess that is the inevitable conclusion, though who knows how long that will take.

{/end rant)

[thursday 1]

Bobby, the UK housing market is in big trouble. It's worse than even the US.

 

Here's an indicator, the Baltic Dry index is down 30% form the start of the year. The world is heading to recession.

[tripitaka 0]

Japan's alright. I did the math and it's cheaper than renting. However, the biggest difference is that you buy a house to live in, not as an investment.

[indosnm 0]

 Originally Posted By: bobby12

House prices are relative though, and thats why they have kept high in the UK despite everyone saying a crash is coming.

For example, my aunt bought her council house in a london suburb for about 80,000 GBP 15 years ago. Now it is worth about 250,000 GBP. Does that make her rich? Not really, if she sells she has to buy another similar house which will also cost 250,000. So she only wins if she leaves and buys a place in Sri Lanka.

True Bobby. I always have a chuckle at the person who tells me how much "they" / their house is worth now.

I7m not going to buy because I can't afford to buy the house I want to live in.
I'll rent and buy when I have the amount in cash.

[Tubby Beaver 209]

Without wanting to start a flame war here, but in my experience, Aussie workers are lazy!! (Not all Aussies, you understand) It was always the Ozzies that were "stopping for a smoko" or standing around talking or nicking off somewhere for this and that. Also there are loadsa jobs in Oz but there are still unemployed. I loved it in Oz and have also contemplated moving there but as I went to Uni and got a degree instead of rolling the sleeves up with a trade, I have very little bargaining power.

 

:stands back and waits for an Aussie backlash:

 

this was all when I was working in Oz myself

[spook 0]

yeah i hear that tubby. depends what industry you're working in though - what were you doing?

in say, unskilled manual labour (i did lots of this while studying), people are always looking to skive off. that's partly because of the job itrself (it sucks) and the kind of people attracted to that type of job (people with no other skills and minimal ambition)

[tripitaka 0]

 Originally Posted By: Tubby Beaver

Without wanting to start a flame war here, but in my experience, Aussie workers are lazy!! (Not all Aussies, you understand) It was always the Ozzies that were "stopping for a smoko" or standing around talking or nicking off somewhere for this and that. Also there are loadsa jobs in Oz but there are still unemployed. I loved it in Oz and have also contemplated moving there but as I went to Uni and got a degree instead of rolling the sleeves up with a trade, I have very little bargaining power.

Calling Aussies lazy is rather subjective. The Japanese consider themselves hard workers, yet in many instances (and in my limited experiences), I find my con-workers' approach "lazy", particularly when it comes to focusing on solutions and/or innovation. Please excuse the massive generalization though.

I have to agree that having a trade is a highly marketable skill down there right now.

[Go Native 70]

 Originally Posted By: Tubby Beaver

Without wanting to start a flame war here, but in my experience, Aussie workers are lazy!! (Not all Aussies, you understand) It was always the Ozzies that were "stopping for a smoko" or standing around talking or nicking off somewhere for this and that. Also there are loadsa jobs in Oz but there are still unemployed. I loved it in Oz and have also contemplated moving there but as I went to Uni and got a degree instead of rolling the sleeves up with a trade, I have very little bargaining power.

:stands back and waits for an Aussie backlash:

this was all when I was working in Oz myself

One of the main reasons I decided to leave Aus was that we were losing the lazy culture. Aussies now have some of the longest average working hours, being only behind Korea and Japan. They also work some of the highest amount of unpaid overtime. Most Aussies now work their butts off (they have to if they ever want to own a house!).

[Tubby Beaver 209]

Yeah I know it was amassive generalisation, and I'm not saying that all Aussies are lazy, just that in my experience working over there, it was always the locals that were skiving off. Spook, you are probably right about the job sector, I was backpacking so it was all manual labour and factory work etc, all unskilled, so the type of people who work in these jobs do have there fair share of layabouts. we worked in this cork factory, doing nightshift. we didn't tell them we were backpackers, as we thought they wouldn't employ us as our visa only allowed us to work for 1 comoany for 3 months max. But at the end of the 3 months they offered us sponsorship to stay on. My brother worked at the end of the line and they were amazed that he was able to work 3 lines at one time. It was very simple stuff, but the turnover in locals was unbelievable, this 1 guy lasted 3 days, said the work was too hard!!!

[bushpig 0]

Yeah, there are a lot of dole-bludgers, and those kinds of labour no doubt do attract a certain type of person (for locals).

[tripitaka 0]

 Originally Posted By: Go Native

 Originally Posted By: Tubby Beaver

Without wanting to start a flame war here, but in my experience, Aussie workers are lazy!! (Not all Aussies, you understand) It was always the Ozzies that were "stopping for a smoko" or standing around talking or nicking off somewhere for this and that. Also there are loadsa jobs in Oz but there are still unemployed. I loved it in Oz and have also contemplated moving there but as I went to Uni and got a degree instead of rolling the sleeves up with a trade, I have very little bargaining power.

:stands back and waits for an Aussie backlash:

this was all when I was working in Oz myself

One of the main reasons I decided to leave Aus was that we were losing the lazy culture. Aussies now have some of the longest average working hours, being only behind Korea and Japan. They also work some of the highest amount of unpaid overtime. Most Aussies now work their butts off (they have to if they ever want to own a house!).

That's my perception too. Aussies have to work much harder to get ahead. Salaries are actually better in Australia than in Japan (unless you're on a good expat package). My Aussie mate was working for a Japanese coy travelling the world training people on how to use the new technologies. In many ways, it's a very important job but he got paid relatively little because of the Japanese salary system (even though there's guys approaching 60 doing absolutely nothing).

The same guy's back in Melbourne now. He was offered a job with the same coy and now makes three or four times more as a marketing manager. He also gets a huge expense account.

[tripitaka 0]

At the end of the day, there's nothing better than doing what you want to do, even if there's no money in it. It's a situation I might be in not so far in the future!!

[Go Native 70]

Here I earn about a 1/3 of what I got in Aus but in terms of lifestyle and happiness there's just no comparison. I love Hokkaido!

[HelperElfMissy 42]

Way to go GN.

 

There are lots of lifestyle choices to be made in relation to your employment. Are you working to finance your life, or is the work your life? Some people are passionate about what they do, and others only go to work to finance the other things in thier life.

 

A good work ethic transcends culture and ethnicity, and you will find bludgers and hard workers in all communities. I get a bit annoyed that the Aussie system does make it a bit too easy for the bludgers, and taxes the heck out of the hard workers to afford it...however I also see the need for a genuine safety net for those genuinely in need.

 

Although it may be true that there is a higher proportion of people not prepared to work hard in unskilled positions, we have found in our own business that there are some AMAZINGLY hard working people doing monotonous and basic jobs.

 

Personally my priority is being Mum to my boys - so I have only returned to work in 2007, and only school hours. I work limited hours, the money would be better if I went on-call, but the predictability of a school based job suits my priorities. When I am at work I am doing the best job I am capable of - but I don't take my job home with me. The good thing about the shortage of workers in Perth is that you DO have some bargaining power in getting positions that suit YOU in respect of hours and conditions. Not everyone works a 40+hr week.

[Mantas 3]

 Originally Posted By: muikabochi

I'm interested in the "it lacks a lot of things" comment, Mantas - like what?

Well, I'm only going off the complaints I hear from new Australians and long time visitors, for me it lacks nothing, I love this place.
It's hard to put your finger on it, my wife used to say that a lot when she first moved down here. In the end it didn't matter, whatever it lacked she didn't need anyway.
Coming from the UK or Japan where you have 200+ people/square kilometer to Oz (6 people/square km) there is going to be some obvious differences in the facilities and infrastructure available. Culturally we are pretty isolated. We don't have 20 different countries and languages on our door step like the UK. We also dont have 2000+ years of architectural spender to marvel at. These things will become more and more apparent to some newcomers as the novelty of beaches and sunshine, and wide open spaces slowly wears off.

[Mantas 3]

As for our work ethics. I won't accept that we are lazy. We dont like work that's for sure. We won't hid that. But it's not the same as being lazy.

 

Trade shortages

 

Today I arrived on the job and the client handed me a 10k cash bundle before I started the job! True! 90% of the job price and I had barely gotten out of the truck! He was so glad I was starting his job. I couldn't believe it.

It should also be noted that I worked 14 hours today and a good part of that was in a hot, dirty, cramped roof. No wonder there's a shortage!

My apprentice's younger brother just got posted to a North WA mining town. He will earn over 10k a month + accom +meals + flights. This kid is 19!!!

 

 

 

[HelperElfMissy 42]

What we lack:

 

Shopping - Perth is worse off than Melbourne or Sydney here - but the range and prices you can find in Hong Kong, Tokyo, London and New York - they can never be found here - the population is too low to support it. Having said that there is shopping, and until I experienced shopping in those other places I knew no different. There is also Internet shopping that can fill a void!

 

Public Transport - we have it, but not like your big majors mentioned above. However most people own a car - it is a different culture... There is too much space between our sparse population to warrent an Underground Metro. You WILL be able to get from A to B though.

 

Dining - some mentioned that eating out is not as good here - well... I think you can find divine resturants where ever you go. Maybe not a Kobe Beef Teppenyaki, but a fabulously simmered lamb shank can be just as good on a cold winters night.

 

Medical - remote communities - no not really good access to advance medical treatment at the local hospital, but the Royal Flying Doctor Service will get you to a hospital that does have what you need ASAP. I have done a fair bit of medical interpreting, and know a lot of doctors in my area - and the facitilies are generally very good. There are waiting lists in public hosptials, but this is more because our government introduced medicare and then promoted it as an ALTERNATIVE to private health isurance rather than a safety net of basic care for those who can not afford insurance - hence todays queues. Get private health insurance and wait no more!

 

There's a few more tidbits to ponder.