I need to rant a bit (toyu heaters and cold houses)

[muikabochi 208]

OK. This morning it was really cold. The friggin' oil heater decided to pack up after 10 minutes for some reason in my bedroom so I got up and out of bed in freezing conditions. Could see my breath... surprised it didn't freeze up. So I get into some clothes and go downstairs. Put on the oil heater there and it started its beeping telling me it had run out of toyu. So go to the genkan, get the pump thing and start pumping some toyu into the heaters tank. Getting oil on my hands and a bit on the genkan floor in the process. Then put the tank back in the heater. Then it takes a few minutes for it to start up. I'm cold!

 

It all just seems so utterly primitive. If people back home heard about this lot, they wouldn't believe it. I wonder why much of Japan puts up with this.

[Ocean11 0]

Yep. It's nuts. That's why we're desperately looking for a place to put up a small, well insulated house with solar and wind powered heating and cooling.

 

Almost anywhere will do, as long as the stupidity of traditional Japanese camping indoors is eliminated.

[muikabochi 208]

That sounds good. Any near finds?

 

It just really winds me up on days like today. It is truly pathetic.

[bushpig 0]

 Quote:

Originally posted by Ocean11:
the stupidity of traditional Japanese camping indoors

O11 that is the best way I've ever heard it put!


Hokkaido housing is properly insulated right?(please correct me if I'm wrong) Why can't they do it in the rest of the country?

[Ocean11 0]

> Any near finds?

 

Going to look at a place tomorrow, smetrafect. It has a rather smelly builder's merchants and chemical waste dump on it at the moment, but as you know, there are three back hoes for every single person in Japan...

 

The sound of the wife's bare feet making sucking noises on the wooden floor in wintertime...

[dale#1 1]

Tell me about it.

I hate those things.

[gamera 0]

 Quote:

Originally posted by muikabochi:
I wonder why much of Japan puts up with this.

Just my opinion. If people had entire house heating system, it would probably cost bloody much more than that because toyu is not cheap here. Maybe that's why.
In old days some Japanese houses had some "irori" and others used "mametan" or "yutanpo" thing to get warm. So I think there was not the idea to heat up entire house all the time. Maybe it's also a kind of traditional thoughts to save energy ( not consuming too much ).　
Muikabochi, doesn't your stove have a timer?

[dale#1 1]

It doesn't all have to be about heating. How about some simple insulation???

[muikabochi 208]

gamera

 

Yes both my stoves have timers - bloody primitive thing that is as well.

[gamera 0]

Hummm primitive.

Do you need to make fire by some stone, then?

[gamera 0]

Ah, dale#1.

Houses nowadays have good insulation system, I guess. But traditional Japanese old houses usually don't. That's why I guess muikabochi has hard time.

[damian 0]

 Quote:

Originally posted by gamera:
Maybe it's also a kind of traditional thoughts to save energy ( not consuming too much ).　

If that were a valid reason then insulation would be used across the country. I lived in an expensive house in Japan and froze to death in winter whilst I baked in summer. I now live in a dodgy and cheap East London studio apartment in a pooly maintained building. It is amazingly temperate and comfortable - I seldom use a heater and if I do, it is my kotatsu. And I don't even own an air-conditioner!

I feel sorry for you guys. Most Japanese housing is exactly as Ocean describes it. The houses are poorly built from an energy perspective, requiring constant heating or constant cooling.

[fatchick 0]

I live in a fairly new house here. I'm pretty sure there is no insulation. Sure feels that way in a morning in winter. I can only imagine how bad it must be for people living in really really cold places. I think I would struggle getting up every morning.

[gamera 0]

Yeah _spud I hear stone houses in Italy have 60cms thick walls which work really good - not hot in summer, warm enough in winter.

Unfortunately wood houses don't work like that.

fatchick - I guess perhaps houses might be also considered one of articles of consumption in Japan. Seldom hear some ( especially houses built recently ) would be maintained over 100 years. Every 20-50 year they were destroyed and built again.

[damian 0]

 Quote:

Originally posted by gamera:
Yeah _spud I hear stone houses in Italy have 60cms thick walls which work really good - not hot in summer, warm enough in winter.
Unfortunately wood houses don't work like that.

.....which is why you should put 3 inch thick wads of fibreglass or other such material in the walls and roof cavity. Even shredded sheep's wool does a great job.

[snobee 0]

Spud - during my limited time in london - 1 year - I spent a life threatening cold winter in Camden Town.

Admittedly my room was the basement, but I had never experienced fogged up mirrors inside a house before, verging on icicles hanging on the curtains. And upstairs was hardly an improvement.

The woman I shared with (the owner) taught me what good ol' Brit Stoicism was all about.

No thanks.

 

And yes insulation, or the lack of, is definitely a key factor in the freezing conditions inside homes here. Like it's hardly new or innovative technology, so why is it taking eons to become the norm???

 

I hate kerosene, so unfortunately my heating bills (electricity) are thru the roof.

[damian 0]

Sounds nasty! Both my apartments in Rondon have been old and very basic. But both have been very comfortable and maintained a pretty stable interior temperature.

[Fattwins 0]

I put a hole in my six inch walls a few weeks ago and found 1.5 inch insulation. 3.5 inches of space equals drafts inside the walls.

[soubriquet 0]

Hmm. Gf's house is fully insulated, double glazed, centrally heated and air conditioned. I can report that it is very comfortable, winter and summer.

[Curt 1]

I'd say you were in a small minority there soubriquet. I don't think I've ever been in a Japanese house like that.

[misorano 1]

Went and had a look under a log cabin yesterday. The owner has stapled polystyrene boxes (like they use at the fish markets)under the floor boards to provide insulation.

[Ocean11 0]

We went to look at house showroom today featuring lots of stuff imported from Germany and Canada. Seriously insulated windows and underfloor heating. It was nice and warm even without any heating. The man knew his insulation and power generation stuff too. It looks likely that we'll ask him to build something for us. He was Japanese, but he had barely disguised contempt for Japanese housing design and construction (and its typical consumers).

[soubriquet 0]

What sort of attention do they pay to ventilation, Ocean11?

[Ocean11 0]

I believe that Japanese law now requires a 24-hour automatic ventilation system to be built into houses. But that's something I need to ask about.

 

I'm interested in this idea;

http://www.thenaturalhome.com/earthtube.htm

 

I was pleased that the bloke didn't flinch when I mentioned composting toilets either. Give me the details quoth he, which is the first time I've heard a builder say that.

[me jane 0]

This was my apartment in Jan 2001 in Tokyo.

 

 

But as we all know, "Tokyo doesn't need insulated walls & rooves or double glazing because its not cold enough".