AT bindings vs apline inserts?

[jgraves 0]

Getting pretty tired of hiking BC ascents and starting to think about all those end-of-season deals. For any who have skiied the following combos, would love your input. . .

 

1) Alpine binding AT inserts w/ my current alpine boots

2) Apline binding AT inserts w/ AT boots

3) AT bindings w AT boots.

 

From an economic standpoint, #1 is the clear winner, but is it a realistic option? Also, for those who have skiied both, what're your thoughts on AT bindings vs inserts? Cheers.

[Fattwins 0]

At bindings with alpine boots will give you the performance you want.

[mattlucas 0]

I've done all 3

 

-For the best downhill performance with bigpowder skis you want Number 2

-But if you don't mind sacrificing a little downhill performance for uphill ease then I'd go with number3

 

-I currently use number 3 as my touring setup. 190 Volkl Explosives, Freeride bindings with red Denali boots

 

-I HATE number 1. I used Secura fixes and have had so many problems with them. Bolts missing, bolts breaking, inserts collapsing. My friend just on the weekend had to turn around 30 minutes into our trip because of the stupid things.

[Fattwins 0]

thats why they made trekkers.

 

The question also is how serious are you about touring?

 

how stiff do you like your boots?

[mattlucas 0]

Treckers lose bolts as well

 

I think that the part of the SecuraFix that you attach your boot to is better than the Trecker. It is pretty bomber and really easy to adjust.

 

It's the part of the SecuraFix that you put in the binding that I have problems with.

 

Even with the new touring boots on the market you are never going to get a boot that is as stiff as a true downhill boot

You have to sacrifice a litle downhill comfort for uphill and hiking ease.

 

Or you could grind the base off of your downhill boots to make a rocking platform and glue on a vidram sole. A few people do this but there are release issues from that.

[Fattwins 0]

trekkers are way better tha S.fix but whichever you are carrying extra unwanted weight

[mattlucas 0]

I remember when I first came on these forums that you were all Treckers this and Treckers that

You didn't believe that the FreeRide binding was strong enough

Things change eh

[Fattwins 0]

yes they do but things have also gotten better with them. my friends in Canada who used them always had movement issues and breakage problems when sking hard. They have fixed those plus ive gotten older and i dont flat jump anymore. Plus Ive gone from touring from the resort to touring and camping etc. I understand the wieght issues now with big packs.

[jgraves 0]

The knees aren't what they used to be, but they've still got a few more semi-hard seasons left in 'em and I love my boots. #2 it is. The wallet was hoping you would come back and say that inserts are the best thing since deep fried, curry-filled bread, but. . . now I can go ahead and buy those trekkers with easy conscience. . . until the rent is due.

[Fattwins 0]

Which one do you want? http://www.backcountry.com/store/group/27/c1/s3/Alpine-Touring-Bindings.html?id=izePQRNr

[jgraves 0]

Its a toss between the nx21 and the freeride. I like beefy bindings if for nothing more than the mental factor. B'sides, if I'm going to be skiing on the way up instead of hauling em from now on, I'm not as concerned about weight. Guess I'm leaning toward the nx21.

[Fattwins 0]

the other naxos will break

[mattlucas 0]

Don't listen to him Tohoku

The new Naxo is even burlier than the FreeRide

 

I totally misread the first post

If you are at all serious about backcountry skiing/touring you should stay away from inserts like the trekker and SecuraFix

 

It's fine to use Alpine boots with and AT binding. For backcountry downhill performance it's the best option

 

Save your money and either wait to buy real AT bindings or buy them now

 

Just my opinion

[Fattwins 0]

Toque I said the other naxos not the 21s.

 

if you go inserts buy trekkers trust me on that.

[jgraves 0]

 Quote:

Originally posted by Toque:

I totally misread the first post

Nope, my bad. I typed the exact opposite of what I meant for #2 on the first post. But you both knew what I meant. Thanks. That may just be worth a fifth star for the both of you.

Stupid question: I like the edge risers give on the inevitable icy patches. I guess there's some extra height built into AT bindings, but does anyone use risers with AT bindings? Would using risers cause safety or breakage issues?

[sock_monkey 0]

do not put risers with AT bindings. they give you more height than you want as is.

[Fattwins 0]

yeah dont put risers on! some people take the front shim off of the freerides.

[mattlucas 0]

Just giving you shit FT

 

I guess FT , SM and I are the smartest people on the planet

 

The 2 geniuses above are right

 

I can't speak for the Naxos but the FRs are already high enough.

I just went out to my car and checked. Your boot will be 3.5cms above the ski. That is for both heal and toe. NO forward lean like on a downhill binding which is why FT said some people take out the front shim

 

Your next decision will be which binding:

Freeride

Naxo

Silvretta

 

I'm really working to get back to my 5 stars here

[Fattwins 0]

unless you are a park rat or a jumping fool ie jumps to hardpack the bindings will hold up.

 

Naxo21s look strong I trust them but any other one will break in time.

[jgraves 0]

Wow, 3.5cm!?! That's bigger than my. . . er. . . risers. No brainer, huh.

 

If memory serves, I think I saw a set of nx 21s on sale for a little over 4 man in Ochanomizu last weekend. Don't do any jumping any more (not on purpose any way), but still get aggressive on special occassions. I don't know, in the store the 21's just felt somehow more "substantial" than the others. Using the force, however, is probably not as good as asking people who have actually skiied on several for their opinions, so fire away if you feel strongly either way about the 21's.

 

Hey SM, saw those great pics from your trip to Fukushima. Was that Adatara? Azuma? Heading back up that way fri am and the area has gotten another 2/3 meter since the weekend.

[Fattwins 0]

21s look bomber

[mattlucas 0]

Freeride ----- 12 DIN

Naxo21 ------ 13 DIN

Pure --------- 10 DIN

TLT Comfort - 10 DIN

 

Freeride ----- 1.99 kg

Naxo21 ------ 2.265 kg

Pure --------- 1.78 kg

TLT Comfort - 998 grams

 

Freeride ----- 39mm above ski

Naxo21 ------ 43mm above ski

Pure --------- Pivot point is 3cm back from front of toe

TLT Comfort - Have to buy DynaAT boots for this one

 

Pretty much the same

Naxo21 is beefier but heavier

I'd just get whatever is the cheapest

[Fattwins 0]

id say that they are pretty equal I still trust the freerides more though a bit more proven. Im worried about the arms on the naxos the old ones couldnt take a ski knocking into them.

[sock_monkey 0]

according to some tests they both have the same torsional stiffness so downhill performance is about the same.

 

the major differences are that the Naxo has a real alpine toe piece and the double pivot. the toe piece, in theory, would be a safer option if you do some resort skiing with them. If you plan on using alpine boots, the double pivot provides a smoother climbing motion (it's quite nice IMO).

the nx21 also has a lock to prevent unwanted insta-tele but that usually isn't an issue for most skiers.

 

personally, i don't think you can go wrong with either binding. like pompom head says if the price is right grab whichever.

 

if you want to do your own research, there is great info here:

 

http://www.wildsnow.com/articles/naxo_faq/naxo-binding-faq-index.html

 

http://www.wildsnow.com/articles/fritschi_binding_faq/fritschi-bindings-index.html

 

 

yeah, that was Azuma on Saturday, Owayama on Sunday.