konasama 0 Posted February 4, 2003 Share Posted February 4, 2003 Any good snowmobile location not too far from Tokyo ? Link to post Share on other sites
damian 0 Posted February 4, 2003 Share Posted February 4, 2003 those things go off! what kind of bindings do you use? Link to post Share on other sites
SKI 15 Posted February 5, 2003 Share Posted February 5, 2003 Those things are fun, a friend of mine in Fukushima has one and zooms all over the covered rice fields in winter. Link to post Share on other sites
Ocean11 0 Posted February 5, 2003 Share Posted February 5, 2003 Snowmobiles are noisy, very smelly, and usually driven with reckless disregard to the peace and safety of others. Link to post Share on other sites
SKI 15 Posted February 5, 2003 Share Posted February 5, 2003 ....Perhaps driven by people who have reckless disregard to the peace and safety of others, doing what they want just because they want to do it that way. They shouldn't do that. Sounds familiar. Link to post Share on other sites
damian 0 Posted February 5, 2003 Share Posted February 5, 2003 I HATE jetskis in the ocean (and usually the type of people that ride them). I have seen snowmobiles ridden in the same manner ever since I was a kid. I agree with ocean. I still want to know what type of bindings are best. Link to post Share on other sites
peaker 0 Posted February 5, 2003 Share Posted February 5, 2003 Couldnt agree more, stinky, noisy and the absolute best way to start avalanches too! Link to post Share on other sites
miteyak 0 Posted February 5, 2003 Share Posted February 5, 2003 Absolutely. Added to this, they're polluting. The two strokes put out the equivalent pollution of 1000 cars. Hardly justifiable riding one in a place where most people have put in a lot of effort to get away from all that! (unfortunately ) 'bilers are one of the fastest growing areas of the avalanche victim stats... Link to post Share on other sites
mikazooki 0 Posted February 5, 2003 Share Posted February 5, 2003 never come across one without a flashing light on myself. but i like the landcruiser on tracks at nozawa. i asked the dude if i could drive it, but he said no. Link to post Share on other sites
konasama 0 Posted February 5, 2003 Author Share Posted February 5, 2003 Not wishing to argue but 1) I could use a 4 stroke. 2) Driving/Flying or going by train to the resort are not exactly polution free 3) Bridges/weirs/dams/roads which provide access to the mountains ( esp in this country ) mess up the environment as well. 3) There may be a snowmobile course somewhere which would not disturb skiers ( a very sensitive lot apparently ) No need to answer I am signing off Link to post Share on other sites
damian 0 Posted February 5, 2003 Share Posted February 5, 2003 guess i will never find out what type of bindings are best on a snow mobile. dang. Link to post Share on other sites
spyder 0 Posted February 5, 2003 Share Posted February 5, 2003 Bindings? On a snowmobile? Link to post Share on other sites
miteyak 0 Posted February 5, 2003 Share Posted February 5, 2003 Sensitive bu**ers, those 'biler types! Link to post Share on other sites
HEAT 0 Posted February 6, 2003 Share Posted February 6, 2003 I've never tried it but it looks fun. Is it? Link to post Share on other sites
RayInJapan 0 Posted February 7, 2003 Share Posted February 7, 2003 hmmm...I've never ridden a snowmobile, but I own 5 jet ski's. Been riding/racing them for 10 years, in lakes and in the ocean. There is no denying jet ski's have carbon fueled combustion engines, and the end result is some form of "pollution" (2 or 4 stroke motor, doesn't matter - it pollutes). Most of the hype over how much ski's pollute is fueled by environMentalists who prefer there are NO forms of combustion engines. They just pick on jet ski's cause ski's are in the minority but you can bet that eventually they are going after all carbon fueled motors, just like they do snowmobiles, dirt bikes and even mountain bikes cause they "tear up the enviornment too. There are far more diesel powered trucks/cars and boats than there are jet skis. And alot more 2 stroke motored boats too. I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say the trains and buses that a lot of folks take to get to work or play aren't pollution free either but I don't see many folks opting to walk to the slopes or to work. (I know the trains are electric, but that electricity doesn't grow on trees). The topic of my post could be dragged on for years, so I'll leave it at this - I ride and race jet ski's. If it really bothers some folks, no worries - to each his own. We haven't really met yet so its not really a loss on anybody's part. I respect other peoples opinions/actions unless their opinion/actions results in the pain and suffering of another person. Its a free world (mostly) Link to post Share on other sites
damian 0 Posted February 7, 2003 Share Posted February 7, 2003 hey ray, please don't get me wrong - a) not everyone on a jet ski is an a-hole. It is the 'hobby', weekend expensive show off toy type riders that cause the moist problems I think. They can be the bogans of the water. And they usually know nothing to be honest, the only pollution I really care about from jets is the noise pollution when I am trying to enjoy a surf. Plus the chop they make in the wave. I tend to get crappy with them as I am trying to interact with the waves in a little more of a natural manner. I reckon there are a lot idiots on them that give them a bad name. To be honest I see little difference between riding a jet and a trail bike, and I seldom bag the trail bike riders. But then I they seldom seem to behave badly in areas where people are trying to enjoy themselves. As for racing jetskis - I wouldn't take you to task on that. It is just as valid as racing sports bike or trail bikes or any other typoe of small boat. But I doubt you need me to tell you that. cheers n have fun. Link to post Share on other sites
snowboard_freak 0 Posted February 7, 2003 Share Posted February 7, 2003 Jet skiers around beaches (especially crowded ones) are an accident waiting to happen. So many times i have been out in the surf and had jet skiers ruin waves (as db mentions - but it deserves another mention cause it is friggin annoying) and i have seen a swimmer get smacked in the head and knocked out cold by some moron on a jet ski who had no idea what he was doing. The guy could have been very easily killed if it were not for a surfer near by who plucked him from the water. I am really - wheres the common sense! Ray - this is by no means a hack at you, just the stupidity of others. Unfortunately it is bad incidents like the one i mentioned that stick in peoples heads. Thus creating a bad "image". Link to post Share on other sites
RayInJapan 0 Posted February 7, 2003 Share Posted February 7, 2003 I have to agree there are A-holes out there on jet skis - the same as there are on skis, snowboards, motorcycles, fishing boats, and surfboards too. At least here in Japan you have to get a regular boat captains liscense (not cheap) before you can operate a jet ski so most folks here know and follow the rules. I grew up in Hawaii, and started surfing at age 10. Stopped at age 22 cause I wasn't in areas with decent waves but i'm thinking about getting back into it cause the waves up here near Misawa are usually pretty good. I still dream about surfing a lot so maybe this summer, I'll see if I can still stand up. Back to Hawaii - Growing up, I learned that no one owns the ocean and we all have to share...the basic rule is "the first person there has rights". Where this is going is that whether I'm going jet skiing, scuba diving, spear fishing or surfing, if there is someone else already there, I go somewhere else (except for surfing). I know that jet skiing messes up waves, so if there are surfers there already, I go somewhere else. If I'm there first though, either wave jumping or surfing the waves on my ski, and a surfer paddles out, thats his problem, not mine - I got there first. On the bright side, the flexibility of a ski allows me to get to places where surfers can't and then I have the waves all to myself anyway. Same with fisherman. If I see them fishing, I make it a point to go way around them even though I know the ski doesn't disturb the fish below (ref my scuba diving). Same with diving - if I go to a good spot and fisherman are there, I go somewhere else, but if I get there first, that water belongs to me while I'm in it. Absolutely SBF - jet skiing around a crowded beach is bad karma, as is beaching a full size boat with a propeller hanging below it. Fortunately in Okinawa, and up here at Misawa, there are few crowded beaches, none of which are where we ride. The bottom line in everything you do is be considerate and most people will be considerate back. Now if I can only get myself to follow that rule more often... Hope to meet you guys on the slopes some day, Ray Link to post Share on other sites
snowboard_freak 0 Posted February 7, 2003 Share Posted February 7, 2003 Good to hear Ray! Sounds like you are one of the considerate ones! If only there were more over here! Link to post Share on other sites
damian 0 Posted February 7, 2003 Share Posted February 7, 2003 ray, so long as you keep riding your jet ski at that snow beach in the pic on your members page, you and I will never need to share the waves. You nutter! >I know that jet skiing messes up waves, so if >there are surfers there already, I go >somewhere else. If I'm there first though, >either wave jumping or surfing the waves on >my ski, and a surfer paddles out, thats his >problem, not mine - I got there first. In some instances I would get into quite a debate about this. usually based on the fact that I feel surfing is puer and more man-on-nature than the jetski, so the surfer has a god given right to the waves over the jet skier. However, as you say, no one owns the ocean. It is true but sometimes I wish it were not . Probably my prefered debating point is that on a 300m beach there may be only one sand bank that is working and I would argue that it is the surfer that would appreciate it more than the jetski rider. The jetski rider could get probably just as much fun out of the close out or ripped up stretch of the beach than the surfer could. A gentleman jet rider who appreciated the quality of teh surf on that particular bank relative to the remainder of teh beach would appreciate the angst that the surfer would feel as it gets torn up by a jet ski. This jet ski surfer would understand the way of the surfer and what the wave means to him and move along the beach. anyway, enough of that preaching. Happy to see you are a good sport about the very whole thing. I have a similar love of the ocean (no, not you ocean11 ) Link to post Share on other sites
Ocean11 0 Posted February 7, 2003 Share Posted February 7, 2003 Thought I was in there with a chance for a moment db. Link to post Share on other sites
nzlegend 1 Posted February 7, 2003 Share Posted February 7, 2003 Quote: Originally posted by RayInJapan: , but I own 5 jet ski's. wow would you mind sliding one of those my way? Link to post Share on other sites
RayInJapan 0 Posted February 7, 2003 Share Posted February 7, 2003 heh heh - which one? Link to post Share on other sites
jared 0 Posted February 7, 2003 Share Posted February 7, 2003 db, that arguement seems a little sketchy. to test my assersion replace the word surfer with skier and jet skier with snowboarder. pretend its a japanese patroller telling you why snowboarders are not allowed on a particular section of a ski field and see what your reaction is. Link to post Share on other sites
damian 0 Posted February 7, 2003 Share Posted February 7, 2003 postscript - thankyou for changing 'crap' to 'sketchy') jared, no doubt you will claim to be a surfer and that you understand what a surfer is thinking when he says what I did. Obviously you dont understand. There is a small difference between a skier and a snowboarder. Essentially both use gravity to slide on snow with similarly constructed and simple tools attached to their feet. Do you think that there a likewise small difference between a surfboard constructed of fiberglass and foam which is powered by muscle power and a jetski which contains an internal combustion engine, goes probably 100km/hr or faster and requires zero skill to actually stand on and accelerate (I dont imply that there is no skill in more advanced jetski riding, it would be quite hard no doubt). Here is a far better analogy, minus the totally innapropriate reference to the ski patrol: Imagine if you were on your skis/snowboard. Big powder field, first thing in the morning, first powder to fall on the hills in 4 weeks. Backcountry bliss. You round the last turn on your hike and you see a snowbmobile churning it back and forth. How would you feel? Sure, neither you or the mobile rider owns the mountain or the snow, but what would that feeling in your gut be? Your analogy was closer to the debate about who has more right to the waves, a surfer or a bodyboarder. Except I still dont see where the ski patrol comes into the picture. [THIS IS NOT INTENDED TO BE A HACK AT THIS CHEERFUL FELLOW RAY OR HIS INVOLVEMENT IN JETSKIS. It is a general discussion sourced from my response to one of Rays ideas. The only reason I responded in the first place is because I am a surfer, it is in my blood, surfers (as a group over history) probably love the waves more than anyone else and understand the waves just as much as a good in-shore boat captain/experienced fisherman] Link to post Share on other sites
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