snowboard_freak 0 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 Bit of a heavy topic but it gets you thinking. Who would you be? The murdered or the murderer? Do you think you have what it takes to kill another human? I've made it into a poll so people can be anonymous if they wish, but please feel free to add your two cents! Link to post Share on other sites
neversummer 0 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 it is pretty obvious to me... Link to post Share on other sites
Fattwins 0 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 If i was faced with dying or killing a murderer than crap ill try to save my asss by any means Link to post Share on other sites
cakehead 0 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 4 : 4 Very interesting. Link to post Share on other sites
miteyak 0 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 The poll is so vague as to be meaningless. Do you have what it takes... I think the satanism must be getting to you... More like, do you lack what it takes to be a functional human, thus are able to kill another. Pure self defense is one thing. Choosing to kill another human a different thing altogether. What are the scenarios here? Interesting study dating back to the American civil (huh?) war. Good cross section of society taking part, ie, all men of fighting age. Historians have concluded from this event, that only one in ten men aimed their rifles to kill other men. Thus, only 10% of men, even in war, could justify murder. Link to post Share on other sites
damian 0 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 what is the situation? Today when I woke up, I didn't feel like killing any one. This is quite typical. On the flip side, I did not feel like being killed either. This is also quite typical. If you are asking whether I would kill so as not to be killed myself, then hell yeah. Killing in self defense is a great excuse to strangle the life from some miserable bastard and watch him shake as the light goes out in his eyes. You could even taunt him as he died. For example, as you throttle the wretched critter you could say to him: "after you are dead, I am going to scratch your car's new paint job!". Cool. Did I just say that or think it? Link to post Share on other sites
mikazooki 0 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 ok, here's the word, but keep it quiet cos otherwise things will get messy. life is it yeah, u get one go. if someone knocks u off, that represents a loss. whereas if u top some other geezer, because u only have one life to lose, u are already in front. not everyone can kill someone, but everyone can be killed. right? sound logic, yes? so all u gotta do to ensure your spot in the winners circle is find some random punter and rub him out. glory is yours for eternity. one of the winning few. but remember, this is not the kind of thing u should be spreading around, u follow? if everyone works it out.. well, u know. anyway good luck. Link to post Share on other sites
Ocean11 0 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 There's a flaw in that logic somewhere, I just know it. I haven't spotted it yet, but that's wrong, definitely wrong. Link to post Share on other sites
snowboard_freak 0 Posted November 5, 2003 Author Share Posted November 5, 2003 Sorry the poll is a bit vague. I hadn't really thought of a specific situation. Imagine that someone comes up to you and says "You have to go and kill someone or I'll kill you." So it's not really self defense (although you probably could argue that it is). miteyak - Satanism isn't getting to me, I haven't written anything about that for a couple of years now. Can't really remember all that much of it anymore as I rarely use that "knowledge". Interesting logic mika. Link to post Share on other sites
miteyak 0 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 In that case, I'd not be either. One can never be sure if someone is really going to kill you... I'd defend myself, and if the other guy died in the process of defense, well... I'd still probably get screwed up with guilt, not really being sure if the would be assailant actually wanted to kill me. It's not a case that I couid/couldn't pre-meditatively kill someone, more that I wouldn't. We've spend thousands of years trying to set up systems to move away from barbaric behavioural traits, and they are in place. I'd do all I could to use them. I'm against the death penalty too, so I guess that answers the question. Link to post Share on other sites
damian 0 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 Quote: Originally posted by snowboard_freak: Imagine that someone comes up to you and says "You have to go and kill someone [else] or I'll kill you." Who would say that?? It is not realistic. Give me realism or give me death. Link to post Share on other sites
Ocean11 0 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 I wonder what is the point of going to a battlefield armed with a rifle and not shooting to kill. It sounds even more foolish than smoking a doobie and not inhaling. If I had got that far involved, I think I could safely say that I would be aiming to slaughter as many armed opponents in as short a time as possible... miteyak, where did you read that curious statistic? Link to post Share on other sites
mikazooki 0 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 ok, i'll provide a more realistic sitch: its a stinking hot day in the middle of a japan summer. u sit down under the shade of some powerlines completely drained by the humidity. then out of the corner of your eye u spot a beer vendy. u empty your pockets, and - shraa laah - 350yen! what was a moment of torture now turns to be a moment of pleasure as your beer goes clunk in the bottom of the machine. but as u bend your weary body over to grab the beer, some frucknoddle swipes by and beats u to it. unfortunately for him he drops his sidearm whilst executing his pilfering manouvre. now comes the decision, as he sits down in the shadiest area under the powerlines and cracks your brew... time for rough justice? [in this scenario, u can't go and ask for your beer back, or shoot the robber in the foot, cos those are the rules] Link to post Share on other sites
sweetaz 0 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 i think if i was being attacked i'd defend myself with the thought of buggering the attacker up to the point where they'd give up or couldn't continue. That way they'd have to face the consequences of their actions. In this scenario I don't think think it would be choice of kill or be killed...if you did end up killing someone in self defence it would more than likely be an accident. You wouldn't have the intent to kill them...just to stop them. If the scenario was kill or b killed.....instinct would prevail. Link to post Share on other sites
miteyak 0 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 You know, I can't remember, I think it was a BBC history program, or some such thing, I'll see if I can find out... Many had no choice, on both sides, but to fight. (they could've been lynched for not enlisting) but they weren't really into slaughtering fellow countrymen... We're talking about trench warfare here, don't forget, so no-one was running up to kill them... Bit like snipers... takes a 'special' type of man to shoot a man dead while he takes a crap... Most can muster up the goods to shoot another, however, when they're one second away from being kebabed... Link to post Share on other sites
rajeem 0 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 Rather unlikely situation, but I could never murder someone intentionally. Link to post Share on other sites
barok 0 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 This weekend I was at a halloween party and there were some rough jock types leaving the place. It was really interesting what happened inside of my head. One of these guys, who probably outweighed me by about 20 kg, was all wasted, and decided to give me the old passing by shoulder slam thingy - you know it right ? Well for what I could see, it was for no other reason than he was drunk, bigger than me, and thought he could walk out of the bar like a tough guy. Some kindov vindication for striking out with the ladies. . . i dunno. Typical jock behavior and I have seen it 1000 times. Anyways, something in my head said "f#ck this guy, it would be real easy to just let him walk out, but I am just so tired of this crap. I would rather get beat to a pulp than put up with this crap ever again in my life." So I pushed him back. Him and three of his friends turned around, and I was like "fuuuuuuh" I looked around, I had no backup, butI stood my ground, anyway. The guy grabbed my shirt with one arm, and right there, I guess you could say my killer instinct kicked in. I grabbed his hand as hard as I could, and started to twist around. Anyone who has taken martial arts knows the move, and I was going to follow it all the way through and break his arm, no hesitation. But his friend was cool enough to get between us and stop the whole thing. I was relieved, because although I would have done everything I could have to break this guy, I would rather not. So yeah, If threatened, I would do someone one worse, no hesitation. But that doesn't mean I want to. And of course I can't say the same would be true for all situations, sometimes, I have just backed-off. Three guys, one with a knife came at me once, and I did my best to play the pussy. Link to post Share on other sites
cheeseman 1 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 I would offer the would-be murdered a nice piece of Lancashire cheese. Hopefully he/she would then calm down and we could sit around an open fire and talk about things. Link to post Share on other sites
snowboard_freak 0 Posted November 5, 2003 Author Share Posted November 5, 2003 Quote: Originally posted by db: Who would say that?? It is not realistic. Give me realism or give me death. Death it is!! It wasn't meant to be realistic Mr db, I was just trying to put forward a simple (although unrealistic) situation. 1 in 10 is a pretty pathetic figure considering it's a war and all. Maybe having all the others are just there for moral support. Go team go! Link to post Share on other sites
miteyak 0 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 Quote: 1 in 10 is a pretty pathetic figure considering it's a war and all. [/QB] I like to think of it as a spark of hope... that not all of us are pathetic neanderthals. It sickens me the ease with which men glorify violence and death. As for war, well, murder is murder, unless it's self defence. I do not recognise the right of the state to sanction murder. Link to post Share on other sites
Thunderbird2 0 Posted November 6, 2003 Share Posted November 6, 2003 Only in self-defence, I reckon. Link to post Share on other sites
oo 1 Posted November 7, 2003 Share Posted November 7, 2003 I don't think I could be a do murder, only under extreme pressure to save myself. Link to post Share on other sites
indosnm 0 Posted November 7, 2003 Share Posted November 7, 2003 Barok, don't forget the ski patrol either! Seems everyone's out to get you eh? why? Link to post Share on other sites
miteyak 0 Posted November 7, 2003 Share Posted November 7, 2003 Actually barok, the same thing crossed my mind... Just how many altercations HAVE you been in? My, 'talk softly and carry a big stick' philosophy has pretty much got me to this far without a scrape. I can't help wondering how some people seem to always brush up with trouble... Link to post Share on other sites
barok 0 Posted November 7, 2003 Share Posted November 7, 2003 I don't get it either, but I have been in lots of fights in my life. And I am often the target of violence as well. I really don't know why, but I think a big part of it is my size. I am 5'8" and I weigh 160 lbs. So I am short, but not too short, and I have a medium build - muscular, with a small gut that has developed in the past 2 or 3 years, but I do my situps. I think my size is significant, because I fall probably right around a 4 on a 1-10 scale of bigness - and in people who bother me's eyes that probably means small enough to take down, but not so small that they will get accused of picking on the little guy when they do. I think these guys see me as a good target, not an easy target mind you, but a good one. Also, if there is someone who is out to bother people in general, and bothering lots of people, I will generally tell him off if he bothers me. Other than that, I don't know. Maybe my appearance comes off as arrogant ? but I don't know how that goes - I don't really have nice clothes. What makes someone look at someone else and say, "I'm going to start something with that guy"? Anyone with any ideas ? Link to post Share on other sites
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