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Arai is one of the areas in Japan that has some guys that understand snow management.

 

If the resort deems the conditionals closed and someone heads into them, they sould know that if they get caught they will get punished.

The name conditionals says it all right, on condition to open.

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Originally posted by mumbojumbo:
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You're missing the point there though MJ
Who at the resort is qualified enough to make that decision
No, I think you're missing the point.

I don't know who is qualified to make that decision, but that doesn't matter. But if the resort is willing to take the responsibility to make the decision (and any consequences that arise from said decision), then it's totally up to them what they do.
no MJ, YOU are missing the point. if the resort is not qualified to deem an alpine slidable area safe yet does, they are putting the lives of many people at risk. if the resort is not qualified to recognise that an area in bounds is slidable (like Naeba)and then has an incident that involves people, it is simply dangerous and unacceptable. if the resort is not capable of accuratly assesing danger and closes an area that is completely skiable to a portion of the visitors they are in fact creating more of a risk by keeping it closed. look at any progressive resort in north america. they are opening up new previously thought dangerous terrian for a variety of reasons. but namely, people can in fact ski the terrian, and as a result will. thus it is much safer to have the area open and patroled than closed and potentially hazardous to said skiers and the retrieval team.

fattwins. by "proactive" do you mean they do control work? do they bomb the area? are other resorts looking at following suite?
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you still don't get it.

do you really want some one who does not know what they are doing making decisions that could cost you your life? even if it is within the boundaries of the law?

my point is that as of yet there is no body in japan which maintains a standard to ensure that an opperation is avalanche safe.

but as i have mentioned, it has been proposed in the diet recently after the many incidents this year. let's hope something good comes of this.

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I don't know much, actually anything about arai, is it that good there? Any pics of the danger zones?

 

 

 Quote:
Originally posted by Toque:

have skied in a few permanently closed areas in W/B and experienced amazing runs of deep powder, pillows and cool straightlines. I do so at my own risk.

I

 

as for you doing it at your own risk, almost every poach at WB is a poach because of the terrain it hangs over, in most cases bowls where the average holiday'r skiis, so really your good times are at there risk.

 

With that said I do my fair share, I dont always calculate the risk(adrenline blocks the blood sometimes) and alot of the times a rollover prevents your from seeing whos below, but at the same time if something goes you have to know that you are about to potentially screw someone else over.

 

As FT hinted punnishment can be stern here, but generally depending on your level of experience(or stupidity) you will losse the pass for about a month.

 

Something thing that I always wondered about, is why is the person who lays the tracks responsible for the person who follows the tracks, to me this is fooey, just because your incapable of taking responsiblity for your desicions does not make me responsible for your life and desicions. A rope is rope, I have had the same oppotunities to educate my self as you. Your on your own. a lemming/sheep/human nature is a poor excuse and just an easy and lazy way to lay your ignorance on someone else.

 

Calculating your risks can narrow your odds of disaster,

 

it's very grey area topic, hopefully anyone who does poaching understands the risks, which in turn contradicts it self.

 

Be smart and dont advertise.

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I am sorry to hear about the problem Blair.

 

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Unfortunately, under the same circumstances with a group of foreign skiers or boarders, the patrols direct order to stop in some cases has been intentionally ignored & even mocked.
Unfortunately that is case in another places I have spoken to. It sounds like only few people causing the problem but those few people with bad behavious is creating some bad feeling at other place too. Which is sad I think.
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A few years back two boarders were reported missing on a Friday.

 

Given that there was new snow at the time, regular grooming could not be done that night to avoid risking running over a body. The next morning the entire mountain was closed while the search continued.

 

Fortunately the boarders were rescued via helicopter (out of bounds) early on the Saturday afternoon, but the day for everyone else was not what they had planned/worked for.

 

My question is:

 

How would you feel if you had come to the resort that day but could not ski/board (despite prime conditions) due to the actions of only two persons the day before?

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I think they should have been charged for the cost of a day's business at Arai. Still does not make it up for those who come from far away to go to Arai and find it closed.

 

They should have ran the groomers and opened the resort anyway if you ask me. I doubt they run groomers in the OOB areas, and I doubt those 2 boarders came undone on a groomed slope as well.

 

My answer to Blair's question: pissed-off. I would then head over to Myoko.

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Blair, have you seen the Niseko Local Rules?

 

I am making some minor grammatical English changes and applying them for "Arai Mountain Local Rules":

 

Rule 1: Entering the cliff area is absolutely prohibited. Lift passes will be confiscated from any and all persons in this area.

 

Rule 2: It is prohibited to pass through the ropes and to go out of management area. Lift passes will be confiscated upon patrol judgement.

 

Rule 3: Individuals climbing to mountain peaks from the resort do so at their own risk. The peaks are beyond marked course limits and are not controlled by the resort. (Insert note about conditionals open/close by patrol here)

 

Rule 4: Based on avalance information, the specific degree of avalance danger is posed daily.

 

Rule 5: Always comply with the instructions of the ski patrol. Failure to comply may result in lift pass confiscation and expulsion from the resort.

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 Quote:
Originally posted by SKI:
daver it seems would be angry at the resort whatever - whatever you say the resort is most definitely wrong.
if the resort is not taking the proper measures to ensure my safety and the safety of others then yes. yes the resort is wrong. are you aware of what "final sweep" is, or are you just trying to be a abrasive jackass?
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There are far more Japanese heading ob than gaijins we just get blamed cause we stick out.

 

Arai uses the air bomb. its a presurized system of pipes put into start zones. It looks like a big sewer tube upside down. it shoots air into the ground to froce a slide. Cortina uses the same system.

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There are far more Japanese heading ob than gaijins we just get blamed cause we stick out.
There was way more Japanese skiers/boarders than gaijins in the first place out there. So the % of gaijin doing it I would guess is much higher than the % of Japanese.

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Unfortunately, under the same circumstances with a group of foreign skiers or boarders, the patrols direct order to stop in some cases has been intentionally ignored & even mocked.
Do many of the Japanese ignore and mock like that I wonder? I doubt it.

I suppose some people here will just say that last comment is a 'made up' one.

These are some of the reasons why 'we just get blamed'.
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Ski, to be fair, re-read what you just quoted. Didn't he say that in some cases these orders have been intentionally ignored? It didn't seem to me like he was saying most or even many of the gaijin do that. Just a few who happen to give the rest of us a bad name.

 

 Quote:
There was way more Japanese skiers/boarders than gaijins in the first place out there. So the % of gaijin doing it I would guess is much higher than the % of Japanese.

You are, by your own admission, guessing. What if, percentage-wise, it isn't actually all that much higher? I don't know, but neither do you. If you do, then back it up with something.
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Didn't he say that in some cases these orders have been intentionally ignored?
Yes he did.

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You are, by your own admission, guessing. What if, percentage-wise, it isn't actually all that much higher? I don't know, but neither do you. If you do, then back it up with something.
Of course I don't know numbers - I am simply applying common sense.
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in SOME cases, doesn't mean in MANY cases. You then flipped the question to say

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Do many of the Japanese ignore and mock like that I wonder? I doubt it.
Nice contrast, giving the impression that it must be many in the case of foreigners, which wasn't quite what Blair was saying right?
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