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I've been to Nozawa Onsen before. Looking for somewhere different. My criteria are different to most snowjapanforum natives.

 

- advanced to expert in the group

- biggish ski hill

- village infrastructure

- place to stay for a month without constant travelling around

- kids, so want to be able to walk/ski to lifts/slopes

- liberal ropes policy

 

There are plenty of interesting looking hills around, but Japan has the 80s legacy thing with zero atmosphere or zero town. So that automatically rules out otherwise potentially interesting places like Kagura, Naeba, Yuzawa, Joetsu Kokusai.

 

Akakan/Akakura Onsen looks OKish, but is it enough to stay interesting.

 

Europe ticks all the boxes except snow and lack of onsens but that's where we've been last few trips. Really, it's perfect except for the snow. Interesting mountains, great lift infrastructure, 100s of small villages with atmosphere and supermarkets, easy to get to, dirt cheap to live if you look around.

 

America's OK but the most interesting places are hard to get to and we'd blow a few days getting there. Plus, TSA won't like my ABS gear.

 

But we'd like to do Japan again. Nozawa was great, but I think another month there would be pushing it. There are only so many times you can do the same lines.

 

Zao looks OK, but a bit small and no hidden options. But the town has what it needs.

 

Hakuba valley has options, but it's so spread out.

 

What we usually do is find a hidden gem and buy a season pass and stay there. Easy done in some places but I can't find any in Japan. Does such a place exist?

 

Not interested in Niseko.

 

Mt Granview?

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There are plenty of interesting looking hills around, but Japan has the 80s legacy thing with zero atmosphere or zero town. So that automatically rules out otherwise potentially interesting places like Kagura, Naeba, Yuzawa, Joetsu Kokusai.

 

Really?!

Yuzawa town is a good base for the resorts around there. It sure has much more life about it than Zao (which has close to none).

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You could check out Kusatsu. Certainly meets the Onsen requirement. Got a lot of facilities for kids. Has a great town, after all it's an Onsen town with a ski hill tacked on. Not the other way round.

 

Not sure you could spend a month there though without hiring a car to check out other places. There is however the option to hike out from the top of the Gondola to a number of interesting places. (note it's not something I've done, or could do, but I do see people doing it)

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Sapporo? Stay in the city.......bus/train/car to wherever has best snow conditions, all the restaurant options u need, off day activities for kids and or significant other

 

**sorry just noticed ur "walk/ski to lifts" stipulation......still, Sapporo isn't far to Teine, Kokusai, Rusutsu or Kiroro

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Akakan and Akakura Onsen certainly is not enough to keep you interested for a month. There are shuttles to Suginohara and Ikenotaira to keep things interesting. There isn't really much of a town either. For variety I'd say Yuzawa town...

 

Are you looking to just be able to walk to the lift every morning?

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Yeah, Yuzawa looks OK. The train station kind of dominates and it has a couple of towers and the Kan-etsu so it's ugly. But there or the other end of the Yuzawa area, Ishiuchi Maruyama, look OK. Still not an alpine village. And getting in taxis/buses/rental cars gets tiring quickly with a group of 10 including kids. Just doesn't work. So it would have to be slopeside.

 

Low rise, a supermarket or two, handful of restaurants, great skiing.

 

Zao seemed to have the cultural thing, onsens, history, atmosphere.

 

I'm used to small farming villages with long ski histories and dirt cheap. North America doesn't do it too well either apart from some Coloradan and British Columbian places. And when they do, you usually pay for the privilege.

 

As I say, Nozawa town was great. Ski hill was great too. Snow was great. Onsens were great. But by the end we were lapping a few lines pretty much continuously (not the most common ones) and there really wasn't a lot more to discover. I'm comfortable exploring but even then ...

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Are you looking to just be able to walk to the lift every morning?

 

Yeah, that's the problem. With kids and a big group not everyone wants to go bell-to-bell like me and one other. And we'll do touring, slackcountry, backcountry quite happily whereas others might want to lap lifts. So we can all end up going home differently and it's great if kids can just go home and chill by themselves.

 

I look at Yuzawa Kogen and see lots of lines under the lift above the village. I see lots of lines off Naeba. I see potential off Ishiuchi. I could definitely stay entertained at Happo One but it seems that competition is high and most people don't stay ski in/out. I could go crazy in Hakuba for several seasons as a single ski bum but not in a group.

 

Last Europe trip we had 1300m vertical, ski in/out, great village and relatively easy to get to. We got very lucky with snow, but that's not always the case, hence feeling the pull of Japan again.

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Akakan and Akakura Onsen certainly is not enough to keep you interested for a month. There are shuttles to Suginohara and Ikenotaira to keep things interesting. There isn't really much of a town either.

 

I mean, we could do that. Be based in Akakan and day trip. It seems like with most places in Japan a few more lifts with a bit more elevation at the top, link the whole area and it would be great. But that's not how it's done there.

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- advanced to expert in the group

- biggish ski hill

- village infrastructure

- place to stay for a month without constant travelling around

- kids, so want to be able to walk/ski to lifts/slopes

- liberal ropes policy

 

Furano. Except for the ropes.

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The obvious one is Niseko but I guess you have reasons for not going there.

 

You say Yuzawa is ugly......you have seen Japanese towns right? Even Nozawa is ugly outside of those quaint 1 or 2 streets. Japan just doesn't really do easy on the eye urban areas.

 

Furano would be good but for the ropes issue....although Haven't they relaxed that in recent seasons?

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It will be hard to find a place with both town and lifts in walking distance. Would you be willing to stay slopeside, and have to drive into town?

 

We'd be willing to use public transport but would prefer not to rent a car for a month when it would go largely unused and not fit everyone if we wanted to go somewhere anyway.

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The obvious one is Niseko but I guess you have reasons for not going there.

 

I'm from Oz. Same reason I've never really considered Whistler. Plenty of cheaper options that are still awesome and not swarming with fellow countrymen.

 

 

Furano would be good but for the ropes issue....although Haven't they relaxed that in recent seasons?

That sounds more interesting ...

 

It's a big downfall compared to Europe, the sidecountry access. My kids are old enough and skilled enough to start learning easy slackcountry but I don't want to upset patrollers taking a group of a half dozen under ropes. I'm good at stealth alone though ...

 

Europe's don't-care attitude or even North America's bomb everything to bits policies are world's ahead of Japan's restrictions.

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It will be hard to find a place with both town and lifts in walking distance. Would you be willing to stay slopeside, and have to drive into town?

 

We'd be willing to use public transport but would prefer not to rent a car for a month when it would go largely unused and not fit everyone if we wanted to go somewhere anyway.

 

Hmm. Well, somewhere in Yuzawa may still make sense. If you stayed slopeside at Naeba, I think there are buses into town, and even to other ski areas?

 

Zao Onsen is a nice village, and there are buses to Yamagata City for shopping. But I don't think it would be easy to visit other ski areas from there, if you want to do that.

 

Inawashiro area (Alts Bandai, e.g.)... you would really want a car. Townwise it is a farming town with a long ski history, and historic Aizu nearby, but without a car, you'd be stuck at Alts/Nekoma for the whole month, which, while they do apparently have liberal off-piste policies, and shuttle bus to downtown Inawashiro, would feel limiting, I think. Would really want a car or van to hit the many other places nearby for variety, I would think.

 

Another possibility would be Shiga Kogen, for huge, linked, ski areas. But again, would need to rent a van or something to get out occasionally.

 

Takayama in Gifu might be a nice base too, if you had a car...

 

Sure you cannot rent some kind of vehicle that would hold everyone? That would really help.

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Although Hakuba is spread out, its quite easy to get to most of the resorts cause of the train and various buses, theres also supermarkets near hakuba station that are well stocked with various goods

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:doh:

 

DiGriz, please be jolly careful with your words. You might need to be censed and apologise issue if you go down that line! :grandpa:

 

Back to Zao. It may well have the 'culture' thing, but once the skjijo closed, the only atmosphere walking around is one of ghost town. And a quiet one at that. A shame really.

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I don't mind a few countrymen walking around, but I prefer not to encounter hordes of drunken foreigners. Places where those hordes congregate the locals are often bitter and cynical towards them too. And the foreign ownership of Niseko businesses and Australian prices for everything, well, I'd rather look elsewhere. I'm sure I'd enjoy it but I'd prefer not to spend my money there if there are other options.

 

I'll look again at Shiga Kogen area and see if there's anything. I haven't considered it for years.

 

Other desirable (but not typically offered in Japan) qualities: long term discounts, ability to cook own meals about half the time to save money.

 

Don't care qualities: nightlife in terms of drinking etc. Purely interested in skiing. Things like monkeys, temples, day trips to cultural sites are desirable to some in the party if the weather sucks. Onsens played a big part in our other trip just because they are so awesome to start and finish a day but not 100% essential.

 

Places I've enjoyed: Fernie, Nozawa, Whitewater, many no-name places in Austria and Switzerland and France.

 

Places I wouldn't enjoy: Mt Granview (sorry), that 50m long indoor ski hill I visited in Belgium as a novelty one spring, Whistler/Blackcomb, most places in Colorado, most places in California, Jackson (too busy), St. Anton (too competitive)

 

Places I'd like if they were easier to get to and/or had accommodation slopeside and/or I could afford: Grand Targhee, Revelstoke, Whitefish, the Japanese places I listed earlier (maybe), Whitewater, Fernie, Lech, Europe (if the snow were reliable)

 

The culture thing isn't that important, but if possible I'd prefer onsens and temples and local villagers over one or two towers and/or Prince hotels dominating the landscape and nothing else.

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What you are after doesnt exist in Japan.

 

For me after this year i have found that yuzawa and Kagura and Hakkaisan (need to duck ropes) is the best combination of a great town and awesome uncrowded skiing with deep deep pow. But you have to drive to the resorts.

 

Nozawa is the only resort that really ticks all of your boxes, but that is getting busier year on year.

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