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My wife and I are talking about getting a new car and I'd like to get a hybrid (thinking about something like the Toyota Estima), but have never owned a hybrid nor even looked at them at the shop yet. I wanted to see if any of you have a hybrid and what you like and don't like about it. Maybe a friend of yours has one and you've been in it, please comment. We need a bigger car and if I am going to buy a new one, then I'd like to get a hybrid :) Anybody else in the same boat?

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Our work vehicles are hybrid Toyota Camrys - they are quiet, nice to drive. The brakes take a bit of getting used to - I find that I need to be much heavier footed on the brakes as the first stage of braking is used to charge the batteries. This is an adjustment that is only really noticable when you get back into a "normal" car.

 

fwiw, having done some rough calculations - based on the extra cost of purchase of a hybrid vehicle (comparing the standard camry to the hybrid camry at prices 2 years ago, and using aussie fuel costs - the savings on fuel will probably not actually recover the additional purchase cost. Do your own figures though, in Japan this might work out differently.

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We'll be getting a new car too before the taxes go up next year. We should be able to get another winter season out of our Cardina. We haven't really thought about getting a hybrid but I'm interested in seeing what others have to say as well.

 

How about k-cars? Do you folks living in snow country have one or see many on the street? I've been doing a little research and it seems that 4WD would be preferable. Anybody have any experience taking a 2WD k-car to the mountains?

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There are a lot of k cars up here, I was surprised as I wouldn't have thought they were very suitable.

 

I've driven up to the Gunma resorts in a k-car 2wd, it was the end of the season and the roads were clear.....I imagine they'd be pretty dodgy on snowy and icy roads

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fwiw, having done some rough calculations - based on the extra cost of purchase of a hybrid vehicle (comparing the standard camry to the hybrid camry at prices 2 years ago, and using aussie fuel costs - the savings on fuel will probably not actually recover the additional purchase cost. Do your own figures though, in Japan this might work out differently.

 

This is what I was wondering myself, but it seems there is a decent rebate from the govt when buying a hybrid here, or did that already finish up? Also, the three percent increase in taxes will start next year and we thought about that, too. 3% of several hundred man will be noticeable. I plan on keeping the car for quite a long time so I don't mind buying new, but I think buying a new/used model would be cheaper. Again, I haven't gone to the dealership yet and am just curious what information others have. Of course I'll need to start reading up on them too.

 

 

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One thing to take into account if you buy a hybrid is that the batteries last roughly 3 years before requiring replacement from what I have heard from some hybrid owners not friends of mine.

 

And it will cost around 1 million yen to replsce them all.

 

That on top of the cost of purchasing it you would be bettet spendinh that money and by yourself a diesel Delica D5 which will go anywhere.

I have the petrol version and have been through mud bumpy forest roads and through snow 40cm deep with no problem.

It is far far more capable than an estima and probably costs less than a hybrid.

 

Forgot to add.

When you consider the original purchase price and savings made I am not sure that a hibrid will work out cheaper unless you keep the car for ten years or so but then if you factor in changing the batteries minimum twice during that period then a non hibrid is probably a better option unless your number one worry is the environment.

 

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The batteries are supposed to last for 7 years, and are expensive to replace - worth checking how long the manufacturer says the batteries should last though as different types of battery will be significantly different.

 

If you do buy a hybrid, I would go for brand new, given that it is relatively new technology, there should be quite big improvements from earlier models to the latest models.

 

Snow dudes suggestion of a Seidel vehicle could be worth looking into - the ford minded deisel gets better fuel efficincy than the Toyota Camry hybrid.

 

 

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One thing to take into account if you buy a hybrid is that the batteries last roughly 3 years before requiring replacement from what I have heard from some hybrid owners not friends of mine.

 

And it will cost around 1 million yen to replsce them all.

 

That on top of the cost of purchasing it you would be bettet spendinh that money and by yourself a diesel Delica D5 which will go anywhere.

I have the petrol version and have been through mud bumpy forest roads and through snow 40cm deep with no problem.

It is far far more capable than an estima and probably costs less than a hybrid.

 

Forgot to add.

When you consider the original purchase price and savings made I am not sure that a hibrid will work out cheaper unless you keep the car for ten years or so but then if you factor in changing the batteries minimum twice during that period then a non hibrid is probably a better option unless your number one worry is the environment.

 

batteries are terrible for the environment let alone thinking about the slaves who mine it in the congo - read coltan.

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I have heard that hybrids actually have a bigger carbon footprint than regular vehicles because of the fossil fuels consumed in the process of making the batteries. Not sure if this is true, but certainly mining for "rare earths" is a very expensive and energy intensive process so it wouldn't suprise me if it is true.

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I drive a Lexus RX450h. 3,500 V6 engine on Atkinson cycle, 2 electric motors, one for back wheels one for front, 4WD. It drives like a normal car, not requiring any special technique, but you do find yourself braking gentler and sooner consciously allowing for regenerative baking.

 

When slowing down for lights, the engine stops. You are on electric only, but since the aircon compressor is electric (not running off the cam) you still have fulll aircon.

 

Normal, non-maniac driving gives me 12km/l. It's not super economical but sufficient.

 

Unlike the first generation batteries, my car's batteries have a 10 year warranty.

 

I've driven Prius when in Japan. The smaller 1,800 engines give a quite remarkable 20 to 24 km/l. I got 20km/l driving up and down mountains on Kyushu, while Tokyo, Hokkaido, Okinawa gave 24km/l. Was quite impressed.

 

Before my Lexus, I have a Previa 3,500 V6 but not hybrid. You'll find the Estima hybrid is a 2,400 flat 4 with an electric motor driving the front wheels only. The only thing I disliked about my Previa was the instrumentation in the middle of the dash, quite irritating when you are checking your speed etc. Plus I couldn't use the captain seats in the second row, 'cos I was driving all the time. Driving the Previa, I felt like a chaffeur.

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I have heard that hybrids actually have a bigger carbon footprint than regular vehicles because of the fossil fuels consumed in the process of making the batteries. Not sure if this is true, but certainly mining for "rare earths" is a very expensive and energy intensive process so it wouldn't suprise me if it is true.

 

true.

google the norwegian institute of science and technology study.

mining for coltan is cheap when its slave labour using their hands.

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Unless you've got the original saloon Prius, it's highly unlikely you'll have to change any of the cells, let alone the entire battery. If you do on a later model Prius, it has been a top selling car in Japan over the last few years and there will be salvaged batteries a plenty from wrecks. The whole battery thing with hybrids is an invented non-issue. Fwiw, Consumer Reports in the US says the Prius is pretty much the most reliable car on the road.

 

There are doubtlessly going to be environmental problems with rare earths, especially local pollution around the mines, but they apply to almost all electronics. Do hybrid cars use lots of coltan?

 

If you're buying new, Honda have a 4wd hybrid Fit out next month and Subaru have a 4wd crossover hybrid called an XV. I think Toyota only do 4wd in their hybrid people carriers and SUVs, which are bigger and more expensive. One thing to remember with fuel economy is that getting a 7km/l people carrier to do 10km/l is a much bigger deal than getting a 15km/l compact to do 25km/l. On a 500km round trip, the former saves 20l of fuel, the latter only about 13. The other problem in Japan is that the highways are so expensive that going anywhere is still going to cost a fortune, even if your car gets great mileage.

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How big a car were you thinking of getting? I have a Subaru Impressa Sport, same inside size as the Subaru XV hybrid. Good size for two adults.It's the newest hybrid on the market so may have the most up to date tech.

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One thing to take into account if you buy a hybrid is that the batteries last roughly 3 years before requiring replacement from what I have heard from some hybrid owners not friends of mine.

 

And it will cost around 1 million yen to replsce them all.

 

That on top of the cost of purchasing it you would be bettet spendinh that money and by yourself a diesel Delica D5 which will go anywhere.

I have the petrol version and have been through mud bumpy forest roads and through snow 40cm deep with no problem.

It is far far more capable than an estima and probably costs less than a hybrid.

 

Forgot to add.

When you consider the original purchase price and savings made I am not sure that a hibrid will work out cheaper unless you keep the car for ten years or so but then if you factor in changing the batteries minimum twice during that period then a non hibrid is probably a better option unless your number one worry is the environment.

 

batteries are terrible for the environment let alone thinking about the slaves who mine it in the congo - read coltan.

 

I'm sure ur Eco friendly, posting ur message by way of a coconut computer transmitted through the ether by renewable energy sources.......unfortunately everyone else in the 1st world (which includes 99.9999999% of the snow sports community) doesn't have the advantage of a zero carbon footprint for their hobbies

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I have no idea how much batteries on newer cars cost but the one on fjef's old 2001 (sedan) prius which I inherited cost¥150,000 to replace. Did that in late 2008 (or 9?), so the battery was about 7-8 years old then. It would probably still be going today but the car wound up sitting out in the inaka undriven for a few months, including thru a rainy season and the battery somehow shorted out. Hybrids need to be driven regularly as I found out... at that point it was either dump the car (worth nothing here without battery) or buy a new one and start using it in the city. I did the latter, the car is still running great, I love having it in the city - and battery is still running on full charge 4 years later. Last time I talked to fjef about the same model Prius he got when he went back to Canada, it was still going fine - on the original battery.

(Edited post:- note to self - don't type replies late at nite when needing sleep! :doh:

Edited by sunrise
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One thing to take into account if you buy a hybrid is that the batteries last roughly 3 years before requiring replacement from what I have heard from some hybrid owners not friends of mine.

 

And it will cost around 1 million yen to replsce them all.

 

That on top of the cost of purchasing it you would be bettet spendinh that money and by yourself a diesel Delica D5 which will go anywhere.

I have the petrol version and have been through mud bumpy forest roads and through snow 40cm deep with no problem.

It is far far more capable than an estima and probably costs less than a hybrid.

 

Forgot to add.

When you consider the original purchase price and savings made I am not sure that a hibrid will work out cheaper unless you keep the car for ten years or so but then if you factor in changing the batteries minimum twice during that period then a non hibrid is probably a better option unless your number one worry is the environment.

 

batteries are terrible for the environment let alone thinking about the slaves who mine it in the congo - read coltan.

 

I'm sure ur Eco friendly, posting ur message by way of a coconut computer transmitted through the ether by renewable energy sources.......unfortunately everyone else in the 1st world (which includes 99.9999999% of the snow sports community) doesn't have the advantage of a zero carbon footprint for their hobbies

 

yes and no.

being aware of these issues is a start and has helped me change my consumption habits.

i try to splitboard more than use lifts and machinery but i still have to use airplanes to get to destination.

i buy old used cars and rarely upgrade my electronics.

its not about having zero footprint.

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One thing to take into account if you buy a hybrid is that the batteries last roughly 3 years before requiring replacement from what I have heard from some hybrid owners not friends of mine.

 

And it will cost around 1 million yen to replsce them all.

 

That on top of the cost of purchasing it you would be bettet spendinh that money and by yourself a diesel Delica D5 which will go anywhere.

I have the petrol version and have been through mud bumpy forest roads and through snow 40cm deep with no problem.

It is far far more capable than an estima and probably costs less than a hybrid.

 

Forgot to add.

When you consider the original purchase price and savings made I am not sure that a hibrid will work out cheaper unless you keep the car for ten years or so but then if you factor in changing the batteries minimum twice during that period then a non hibrid is probably a better option unless your number one worry is the environment.

 

Snowdude, I've thought about the Delica too, but they just look cheaply made to me when I got inside it and sat in the drivers seat. I'm not saying they're not solid, they just look cheap to me. I have a Subaru legacy which I love but two car seats in back makes it tough for me to sit comfortably with my long legs, so I'd like something more spacious.

 

Hilux SR5 turbo diesel, indestructible, goes forever, don't see many in Japan .

That's because the Taliban have exported them all!

 

How big a car were you thinking of getting? I have a Subaru Impressa Sport, same inside size as the Subaru XV hybrid. Good size for two adults.It's the newest hybrid on the market so may have the most up to date tech.

 

I love my Subaru - Sega rally that thing like it's going out of style. When lots of other cars are getting stuck going up the mountain roads, it bombs up them through a foot of fresh snow like its nothing. I love it! Worst road conditions I've ever been on in Niigata weren't a problem. As I said, something which holds more people and gives me more leg room. I'd like a hybrid, but don't know much about them and was hoping to hear from others because I'm not the most knowledgable car guy.

 

Thank you all for your answers, they have given me lots to think about when considering which car to buy next.

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One thing to take into account if you buy a hybrid is that the batteries last roughly 3 years before requiring replacement from what I have heard from some hybrid owners not friends of mine.

 

And it will cost around 1 million yen to replsce them all.

 

That on top of the cost of purchasing it you would be bettet spendinh that money and by yourself a diesel Delica D5 which will go anywhere.

I have the petrol version and have been through mud bumpy forest roads and through snow 40cm deep with no problem.

It is far far more capable than an estima and probably costs less than a hybrid.

 

Forgot to add.

When you consider the original purchase price and savings made I am not sure that a hibrid will work out cheaper unless you keep the car for ten years or so but then if you factor in changing the batteries minimum twice during that period then a non hibrid is probably a better option unless your number one worry is the environment.

 

Snowdude, I've thought about the Delica too, but they just look cheaply made to me when I got inside it and sat in the drivers seat. I'm not saying they're not solid, they just look cheap to me. I have a Subaru legacy which I love but two car seats in back makes it tough for me to sit comfortably with my long legs, so I'd like something more spacious.

 

Hilux SR5 turbo diesel, indestructible, goes forever, don't see many in Japan .

That's because the Taliban have exported them all!

 

How big a car were you thinking of getting? I have a Subaru Impressa Sport, same inside size as the Subaru XV hybrid. Good size for two adults.It's the newest hybrid on the market so may have the most up to date tech.

 

I love my Subaru - Sega rally that thing like it's going out of style. When lots of other cars are getting stuck going up the mountain roads, it bombs up them through a foot of fresh snow like its nothing. I love it! Worst road conditions I've ever been on in Niigata weren't a problem. As I said, something which holds more people and gives me more leg room. I'd like a hybrid, but don't know much about them and was hoping to hear from others because I'm not the most knowledgable car guy.

 

Thank you all for your answers, they have given me lots to think about when considering which car to buy next.

 

If you thought your Suburu was good in snow then youll love the Delica it will run rings round your Suburu.

 

But of course it comes down to what you like.

 

All Delicas have traction control so you can hack them around corners in snow without them sliding all over the place.

 

The seatd will go full flat so you can actually sleep in it if pushed.

 

Mine I bought new so I had leather seats all round heated seats all round wooden panaling around the dash doors consol etc wooden and leather stearing wheel cruise control etc etc.

It also has manual gear levers so can be driven like a manual and two TV DVD players plus navi and a Rockford stereo system.

Delicas are built and customized to customer requests.

 

Compared to a subaru I would think a Delica does not have the speed and corneting performance but if you want a big car that will get you anywhere in any condition at a decent pace with tons of space then I reckon value for money you would not be disapointed.

 

It is also an eco car believe it or not and has cheap tax especially the first year.

 

Anyway down to personal choice.

Wish you luck with finding the right car.

 

 

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It should be pointed out that the tax system for k-cars is changing next year. It'll be going from 7000¥/year to about 24,000¥/year. This means that there won't be too much of a difference between a k-car and a regular sedan.

 

I'm liking the reviews of the Corolla Fielder Hybrid. Seems like a winner to me.

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Snowdude, thanks very much for the reply. I stopped by the dealership today and spoke with a guy there and found out there really is more to them than the one I got in and sat behind the wheel of before. Some nice options and even fully loaded price is cheaper by over 100 man for other vehicles I've thought about. Your Delica sounds sweet, about 30K range? Is it the turbo diesel? Have you had any issues with it? Sorry for all the Q's! Thanks again :)

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Mine is the petrol engine version, I wanted a diesel, but 3 years ago when I bought mine they were not out.

 

I have now done just over 31000 with it and so far running sweet.

 

This summer though as it was very hot, when I pushed it up hill, on the motorway, was doing about 140-150 for several k's with it mind you it cooked the transmission oil.

I just slowed down for a while then the mark went off that tells you the oil is getting hot.

It has never done that since and Mitsubishi told me that can happen with a CVT (constant variable transmission) engine which is in the Delica, when pushed hard in hot weather or if driven hard in 4WD mode, but that it is nothing to worry about and not a mechanical fault.

 

It is due for it's first MOT this coming December and I will have that oil changed just as a matter of course, as CVT engines naturally have a wine to them especially when they get very hot.

It is not a fault but typical of a CVT engine to whine sometimes so I have been told and so I have read.

 

But the car is so far running absolutely fine, with not a single issue unless you count the transmission oil getting very hot, which will anyway happen with CVT engines.

 

The diesel Delica I have not looked into so I am not sure what type of engine it has, and also I have not test driven it. I have, however test driven the 3.0 l diesel Pajero and that thing pulls like a train.

 

One thing when you push the door switch inside to automatically open the door, if you have the car in (N) when the engine is running then the rear sliding doors will not open, I thought this was a fault, but was told the rear doors will not open when the car is (N) mode, something to know should you decide to buy the car.

 

I really wished the diesel Delica was out 3 years ago, because I really wanted a diesel the engines are far more robust then a petrol and have much more lower end torque than a petrol making them even better for pulling through rough conditions.

 

Anyway let me know how you get on and if you decide to get the diesel Delica I would be interested to know how it goes.

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