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Canadian Cage Fighter keeping the peace in Niseko...


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A couple of things;

 

The last time I checked Cronulla and Sydney were both in Australia. They may have unique problems like gang related violence and not neccessarily racism, but they are still part of Australia. I can't believe the amount of "Cronulla denial" I hear, even from people in Sydney, let alone elsewhere in Australia. The debate on whether the aggression and violence is gang related or racism is an interesting one and I don't really know Sydney well enough anymore to know the answer. I only know how I feel when I am in the surf there and I don't like the feeling. When I see Australian surfer visitors in Bali behaving the same way I don't like that either. Yes, there are plenty of nice people in the water, but there are so many knobs too. Maybe the knobs make a deeper impression on me and maybe the Cronulla thing makes me think worse of the knob surfers than I should.

 

If anything the Cronulla incident just made me think of how naive we are about our societies. I now think those sort of incidents are possible anywhere, the other cities in Australia, Singapore, Malaysia, Indonesia, (surely not Japan, but maybe) pretty much anywhere that I have lived or spent any time. It just takes one group to get p!ssed off enough and they will do anything to the other group. Race, religion, gang, I guess it doesn't matter what the actual differences are. As long as there are different groups of people by whatever definition, if it happened in a suburb of Australia it can happen anywhere.

 

As far as it all being Sydney and nowhere else. May I remind you of that other embarrassment to Australia and Australians, Pauline Hanson and her followers were NOT from Sydney. (Yes, JWH was...).

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Originally Posted By: TJ OZ
Originally Posted By: best skier in hakuba
Quote:
Some folk will never accept change. You can't let them set the agenda.


Not suggesting otherwise. Doesn't distract from the problems though.

Heres a few for starters.

Running businesses that are not licensed (health & safety etc); not paying taxes; not joining in the community activities or organisations that they are expected to and kicking up a fuss about it; bad-mouthing local businesses in order to gain themselves.
Basically doing things for themselves without any respect at all for the local community.

The list goes on, but it is difficult to go into more detail without naming names etc. It's not everyone of course, far fom it but it's certainly there and getting more prominent.

I can understand why people do not want dirty laundry to come out and be public as it is damaging to their business and the overall image of the place. (Funny how some of same people might find it fun and just fine to dis and emphasise problems in other places, places where they are not).


I think you are just hanging out with the wrong people. Step aside from the local bickering and your perspective will change back. I don't discuss my business with anyone yet many people pretend to know what I do here. Everybody should be licensed and I like the fact that the hokenjo and shobosho do spot checks. I hope they pursue all of those who are not licecned and enforce the law. We have spent a lot of money to be complient and I suppose I should worry about what others are doing however I don't as I concentrate on what I am doing.


You have no idea who I hang out with.

But one thing is for sure and it is that I certainly do not hang out with people I do not like. That does not mean though that I do not hear many stories and at times come across them. Again I can totally understand why you don't want all that lot to be out in the open.

Oh right, don't know who you are refering to re: 'many people pretend to know what I do here'. Who might they be? confused You do sound important.
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Originally Posted By: gurgle
A couple of things;

The last time I checked Cronulla and Sydney were both in Australia.


But the "cronulla incident" was not, and never would be, related to surfers. Mostly just a mob of drunken yobs from the "westies" who thought it would be a good idea to "have a go" at some people who were different.

Truth to tell, Cronulla is a suburb of Sydney. so they are, in fact, inclusive.

I've lived in the bush almost all my life (apart from a short stint in Newcastle) and haven't seen one tenth of the sort of cr@p that went on in Cronulla that day. And, you can guarantee that there are every bit as many 'racists' (proportionally) here as there are in Sinney or Malbun.

Just because some idiots act up when away from home (and they do it here too - take a look at the "schoolies" thing if you want an example) does not mean that we are ALL the same.

My advice, treat people as they appear to you, not as their race might appear to the sensationalist news media.
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Originally Posted By: JA
Originally Posted By: gurgle
A couple of things;

The last time I checked Cronulla and Sydney were both in Australia.


But the "cronulla incident" was not, and never would be, related to surfers. Mostly just a mob of drunken yobs from the "westies" who thought it would be a good idea to "have a go" at some people who were different.


You only have to flick through the photos on google to see that there is obviously a mix of yobbos AND surfers involved. It's utter denial to think that locals from Cronulla were not at all involved.

Originally Posted By: JA

Just because some idiots act up when away from home (and they do it here too - take a look at the "schoolies" thing if you want an example) does not mean that we are ALL the same.


I am not for a moment suggesting that we "are ALL the same". I am however suggesting that the numbers are larger than we would all like to think they are - I sincerely hope I am wrong.
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I see your point Gurgle. I just have a hard time excepting the surfer/racist connection.

If you take a step back and have a look at racism on a grand scale. Using the jewish holocaust at one end otf the scale and some taunting and name calling with very rare outbreaks of violence in the Australian suburbs at the other, then I don't think we really have a problem. The laws of this country are what predetermines how ethnics and immigrants get treated and they are the same for everyone, with special clauses built in to protect the ethnics and immigrants from vilification. Sometimes I think some of these minority groups need to toughen up a bit instead of always playing the victim.

 

One thing is for sure. If I ever see signs around restaurants, pubs and clubs that say 'Australians only' like they have in Japan. I'll pack my bags and leave.

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Originally Posted By: Go Native
Originally Posted By: Jynxx

In Japan. You are White and you are going to stick out like I did. But..
You don't speak Japanese - strike one
You are not married to a Japanese - strike two
Don't have permanent residency and lived there for under 10 years?


So only if we speak the language, are married to a Japanese and at least have permanent residency can we be considered a local. Thanks for clearing that up Jynxx rolleyes


Mmmm... In Nozawa Onsen, you're not *really* a local until about 3rd generation. Like, the people here are friendly and everything and they don't really exclude you unless you don't help out the community, but you're not really "jimoto".

With the Aussies, I think they're a welcome change but most people get too rowdy when drunk. Just because you and your party want to crank the amp to 11, it doesn't mean the rest of the patrons want to be deafened. There's a generalisation that 'gaijin' are inconsiderate. While it's not entirely true, it's not entirely false either. All in all, it's considered a character trait (:p) but I kinda wish my fellow Aussies were a bit more considerate.

I think the most amusing time is during the Dosojin Fire Festival... Aussies drunk on free sake trying to barge in often find themselves against really drunk and pretty fired up locals. Even I avoid my senpais during the fesitivies >_>;
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True, that, Ryoma!

 

Was there for the fire festival 2009, saw plenty of very respectful and appreciative Australians. Also saw a few eejits! Unfortunately, these f'wits make the rest of us cringe, and give us "real people" a bad rep.

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Quote:
"If you take a step back and have a look at racism on a grand scale. Using the Jewish holocaust at one end of the scale and some taunting and name calling with very rare outbreaks of violence in the Australian suburbs at the other, then I don't think we really have a problem"

 

I don’t think that "taunting name calling and a little violence" is the "other end of the scale". I would say that’s just about where it all starts getting really nasty. There are lots of more subtle forms of racism that would fit onto a racism scale before that. You don’t have to be calling people names on the street to be a racist; you could just be one of those old white employers that always end choosing the white job applicants regardless of suitability for the job. Once you get to "rare outbreaks of violence" you start getting up the scale and if you get all the way to "race riot" your definitely well up the scale.

 

I don’t think you should trivialize the name calling or any violence.

 

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I agree Captain Stag, but many people would say that while its unacceptable to shout racial slurs, its only a bit of joke while name calling ginger people or fat people or bald people. Why is it acceptable to name call these but not when its to do with skin colour or race? (not that I'm saying you are one of these people CS)

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You know what? I'd rather not have a law against racists. That's right, I mean it because I feel much safer when I seek for service like dentists or lawyers, that I'm getting proper service.

When I first went to Australia in '76, There still was the air of White Australia Policy lingering. I knew what I was getting and where things stood, and can tell people who were "racially sensitive". Now, you never know. People are wearing masks, being politically correct for publicity, and it's illegal to be racist. FkMeDead, how can you put a law against peoples feelings. I'd rather have it in open, so there's an opportunity to talk, inform and educate ...

At least Pauline Hanson did do some service to the community in that respect. In the words of my friends dad, a builder who once got ripped off by a Korean which didn't help his racial sensitivity, took me aside at his BBQ and told me that she's just a ghost in a closet but some people feel the way she did.

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Originally Posted By: Captain Stag
There are lots of more subtle forms of racism that would fit onto a racism scale before that. You don’t have to be calling people names on the street to be a racist; you could just be one of those old white employers that always end choosing the white job applicants regardless of suitability for the job.



Mmm, this is where the waters get muddy. Did he miss out on the job because of his skin color or was he just not good enough? Did the cops pull him over because he was black or were they looking for a man fitting his description. Did the real estate agent not want to rent him a house because of 'his type' or did he just have really bad references? Victims??
I'm not trying to trivialize name calling or violence but surely you can spot the difference between the holacaust where 6 million people were killed and the Cronulla 'race riot' (i see you picked up the media term) where no one was killed. Why was no one killed? Because the police, the law, stepped in to protect them from the thugs. If we were a true racist country the police would have joined in the bashing.
I'm not denying we have racist elements in our society, it's disgraceful, but we are no where near as bad as most places I've been.
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Who's making excuses or ignoring our failings?

Holier than thou comments like that are pathetic. Did you chose not to read this bit?

 

"I'm not denying we have racist elements in our society, it's disgraceful"

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Originally Posted By: Jynxx
You know what? I'd rather not have a law against racists. That's right, I mean it because I feel much safer when I seek for service like dentists or lawyers, that I'm getting proper service.
When I first went to Australia in '76, There still was the air of White Australia Policy lingering. I knew what I was getting and where things stood, and can tell people who were "racially sensitive". Now, you never know. People are wearing masks, being politically correct for publicity, and it's illegal to be racist. FkMeDead, how can you put a law against peoples feelings. I'd rather have it in open, so there's an opportunity to talk, inform and educate ...
At least Pauline Hanson did do some service to the community in that respect. In the words of my friends dad, a builder who once got ripped off by a Korean which didn't help his racial sensitivity, took me aside at his BBQ and told me that she's just a ghost in a closet but some people feel the way she did.


I remember an old aboriginal guy on tv during the Hanson days, "I am glad to see that they have all come out of the closet where we can see them." I had a strange similar feeling when I saw all that Cronulla cr@p, my biggest worries about Sydney/Aust were kind of proven to be right.

One more thing, I find I have tolerance and almost expect racism here in Singapore or back in Japan when I lived there, but I have absolutely no tolerance for it from Australians. I, unrealistically perhaps, expect better from my own people. Just an observation.
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It`s actually called mma - mixed martial arts. Usually in Japan its still in a ring- not many cages here yet- but they are getting more common. the only real difference is the angles and abilty to get up by leaning against the cage.

 

mma is not big in Oz yet but the UFC is there this month and by next year will be huge there imho.

 

 

go to www.sherdog.com or www.ufc.com for the lowdown.

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Hmmm interesting happening today.

 

My 12 yr old got sent home from school after being involved in a fight with another boy at lunch time. Interesting point about preconceptions of people forming opinions about how things have played out here too.

 

My boy is a big'un. The aggressor is a little'un.

The aggressor had a history of verbally abusing (and physically attacking) my boy the previous year. He seems to have a real problem. My boy was the big kid with VICTIM stamped on his forehead - a real gentle giant - who got really upset when he was bullyed.

 

The last year or so he has found his inner manhood, and wont tolerate it. He puts up with a bit, but then stands his ground. Well this kid pushed too far today - he stalked him at lunchtime and hurtled abuse at him for no reason. He was asked to leave (not too politely I am sure) by my boy and my boys mates - he was told to leave - and then he was told he had 10 seconds to leave before he got snotted. Kid didnt stop. My boy snotted him.

 

He didn't go all out and brawl with him. And when the kid tried to turn it into a full on fight he just restrained him until teachers broke it up. BUT --> being the BIG kid, and being the one who threw the first effective punch ... my boy is in HUGE trouble. The assumption is he is a thug.

 

People assume stuff all the time.

They don't always ask what has gone on previously before an incident.

And they don't always make the right assumptions.

 

I don't condone violence.

I am really sad that it came to this today.

But I can not blame him for whacking the kid - he really asked for it.

But it really made me think - where do you draw the line on violence... what is acceptable, what is not.

When does it turn from defending ones self to a Cronulla race riot...

wakaranai

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Originally Posted By: D train
It`s actually called mma - mixed martial arts. Usually in Japan its still in a ring- not many cages here yet- but they are getting more common. the only real difference is the angles and abilty to get up by leaning against the cage.

mma is not big in Oz yet but the UFC is there this month and by next year will be huge there imho.


go to www.sherdog.com or www.ufc.com for the lowdown.


Interesting. It be trying to take off in Japan. I've seen posters for similar fights in HK. Real arena thing with people flying in from all over the world to put on a show.
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