Non-smokers deserve more annual leave or pay than smokers.

[Go Native 70]

Even when I didn't smoke I still took regular breaks throughout the day whether to grab a coffee or have a little chat with co-workers. I have never been someone who can sit for hours non stop at a desk looking at a computer and never will be. I've worked with plenty of people who sure don't leave their desk for a smoke break but will spend considerable time surfing the net or constantly chatting. Non smokers are definitely not always more productive in the workplace. Just because you don't leave your desk as much doesn't always mean you are doing more work.

[Kraut_in_HongKong 0]

Originally Posted By: ssar

Quote:

"MANY non-smokers believe they deserve an extra week of annual leave to match the amount of time their smoking colleagues spend on cigarette breaks, Quit Victoria says.

Depends where they work. I know a company that does not allow smoking in their office, so people have to leave the building. To do that they have to logout with their timecard. Hence their smoke time is not paid.

BTW, since some time we have a law in Hong Kong forbidding smoking in bars and restaurants. It's sooooo much better. When will Japan follow? Some places are unbearable.

[grungy-gonads 54]

Some places have a Smoke Free sticker now Kraut. Probably not in the sticks but in Tokyo I have seen more of those popping up.

[Go Native 70]

Change is always very slow in Japan Kraut. Give it another 10-20 years and they may catch up to the rest of the world on smoking in public places

[grungy-gonads 54]

Go Native, out of interest what possessed you to start smoking at that age?

 

Don't most people start out of foolish teenage rebel reasons and get stuck in it that way. Not often you hear people starting to late..

[Go Native 70]

Originally Posted By: grungy-gonads

Go Native, out of interest what possessed you to start smoking at that age?

Don't most people start out of foolish teenage rebel reasons and get stuck in it that way. Not often you hear people starting to late..

Through my teenage years I was into swimming at a pretty high level and so didn't smoke, ate well and all the rest of the healthy living stuff. As I got older smoking in Aus became quite expensive and as a uni student I just couldn't afford it, hell I barely had enough for a few beers each week.
It only got more expensive as the years went on and today I reckon it'd almost be cheaper to support a smack habit than a smoking one in Aus!

When I came to Japan most people smoked, especially out in bars and at restaurants and it is so damned cheap. I started having a few and the rest is history. I've never been overly opposed to the idea of smoking and I now enjoy it and I really don't care overly much about my health anymore. I now live a stress free life which I reckon is about as good for your health as anything can be.

[bobby12 0]

Go Native: genuine question - do you feel bad about smoking in the street when other people are around, or smoking in a restaurant near a table where people are not smoking? Does it cross your mind at all, or do you just think 'they shouldnt be here?' or 'it cant be that bad' etc?

 

Japan is already changing to non-smoking. You can see it on the trains and in public spaces like airports. It is coming in slowly, but as I detailed on another post the government of japan (GOJ) has locked itself into smoking by paying taxes on cig-sales to local prefectures and so those prefectures will block attempts by GOJ to phase out smoking quickly. The driver in UK for antismoking was the NHS which is free and was putting undue money into fixing peoples lung cancer etc.

[Go Native 70]

I take into account the social norms of the place I'm living. Here in Japan it is generally socially acceptable to smoke in bars, restaurants and on the street. If I'm out with a group of non smokers at a restaurant though I will generally not smoke at the table even if I'm allowed to. In a bar though since everyone else in there, including the staff, are usually smoking it generally matters little whether I add to it or not.

Personally, even in western countries, I don't see why some bars or restaurants can't allow smoking just as some don't. This allows choice for those who smoke and those who don't. Smoking establishments can just hire people that smoke to avoid problems with passive smoking issues. But this is not the case of course and in places like Aus smokers have no choice but to head outside.

[Mantas 3]

Originally Posted By: Mamabear

What if Person A a smoker delivers higher productivity in 30 hours a week, than Person B a non smoker does in 40 hours per week?

Quote:

I've worked with plenty of people who sure don't leave their desk for a smoke break but will spend considerable time surfing the net or constantly chatting. Non smokers are definitely not always more productive in the workplace.

Lots of IF's, But's and MAYBE's there guys.
Rule of thumb. Smokers are getting special privileges for servicing a disgusting drug addictive habit.

[Go Native 70]

The if's, but's and maybe's are no different when talking about non smokers. Smoking doesn't mean you will be an unproductive worker just as much as being a non smoker doesn't mean will be productive.

Smokers get no more privilages than anyone else unless approved by management. Most places I've worked smokers and non smokers alike all had the same break times.

[HelperElfMissy 42]

I don't think so Mantas.

 

Bear in mind I have been a reformed smoker for 11 years, so I am not justifying my own smoko's.

 

There are clearly some deadset slackers out there who are smokers, and it would look very obvious that they are always heading out the door for a smoke. But there are also non-smoking slackers out there - plenty of them. And addiction (or choice if you feel you can give up without any problem) to cigarettes is not an actual causality for lower productivity in the workplace.

 

At our business we have a few smokers - quite a few actually. And they have to smoke outside. Often I see them take their mobile phones and conduct business calls from the car park. Multitasking. Or if two or more smokers are having a business related discussion, they might also head out to the car park to have that chat (and have a smoke while they are at it).

[Mantas 3]

You have a different experience to me. All the office blocks that I work on in the city have hoards (yes hoards, 20+ people) hanging around my truck choofing away, hour after hour, the same faces every time. They must have at least 8 breaks a day. All the while the non-smokers are still sitting at their desks, productively or not, wondering what the weathers like outside. I'm sure they would love to go for a stroll 8 times a day outside but there is no provision for them because they don't have a drug habit.

I

[Go Native 70]

Well if the smokers can get away from their desk for that amount of time can't see why there'd be anything stopping the non-smokers heading out as well. Don't know of any workplace where there is a 'provision' for smokers to get more breaks.

[Mantas 3]

Just about every large one in Aus. GN.

 

Hence the new law.

[Go Native 70]

So as part of their contract with their emplyer smokers have an extra bit written in saying they can have more breaks than anyone else? I'd like to see proof of that.

[bobby12 0]

Just make cigs illegal.

 

Cigs serve no good, only bad. Therefore decision is simple.

 

People would lose jobs but it is short term pain and those employees should have seen the writing on the wall anyway.

 

Alternatively, raise tax on them from 1000% or whatever to 100,000%.

[thursday 1]

simpler thing to do would be to go back in time and eliminate Walter Raleigh just after he was born.

[Mantas 3]

Originally Posted By: Go Native

So as part of their contract with their emplyer smokers have an extra bit written in saying they can have more breaks than anyone else? I'd like to see proof of that.

Proof? Contract? WTF. Who said anything about that. It's a guideline or a verbal agreement or a policy or it might be written in hieroglyphics for all I know. I just listen to the non- smokers winging all the time that they don't get the same privilages.

Jeez, are done now?

[BagOfCrisps 24]

I don't get overly worked up about it but smoking just seems such a silly silly thing to do. Think about it, sticking the thing in your mouth and setting fire to it. Whats not silly there?

[Thundercat 60]

I can't wait for tobacco to become illegal... I predict a vast majority of those fun destroying anti-smokers will turn there sights on the next big evil. ALCOHOL. Personally, I would love to see alcohol completely banned. It has the same detrimental health effects...

[BagOfCrisps 24]

Drinking a pint of beer standing next to another person has absolutely no affect on that person though. Smoking does.

[Thundercat 60]

How about lives and families ruined by alcoholism, drunken violent behaviour, drunk driving... surely those things effect people who do not even partake? Never mind the strain on the health care system that non-drinkers have to pay for...

[BagOfCrisps 24]

Thats a different issue.

 

1 man drinking.

1 man smoking.

 

Only one affects the other without the others permission.

[Go Native 70]

Originally Posted By: bobby12

Just make cigs illegal.

Cigs serve no good, only bad. Therefore decision is simple.

People would lose jobs but it is short term pain and those employees should have seen the writing on the wall anyway.

Alternatively, raise tax on them from 1000% or whatever to 100,000%.

Ok so with that sort of thinking maybe we should also ban alcohol, junk food, or just about anything else that may be deemed bad for you. Maybe we should live in a society where people have no choice but to all be healthy or else! Pollution in major cities affects everyone in them badly. Maybe we should ban all cars in cities and all industry and anything else that degrades the quality of air? Simply ridiculous...

[HelperElfMissy 42]

Originally Posted By: BagOfCrisps

Thats a different issue.

1 man drinking.
1 man smoking.

Only one affects the other without the others permission.

That is true to a degree.
But a considerate smoker would take it outside or to a special smokers room (or glass walled extraction chamber like they have in the airport).
And an INconsiderate drinker would get all up in your face and loud and antisocial (maybe).

I know myself and Papa are happy 'I love you' and you and you and you type of drunks ( not that I make a habit of getting drunk mind) - however I know of many who turn downright aggressive and nasty after they have had too much to drink. THOSE people would definitely affect those around them.