Go Native 70 Posted December 14, 2009 Share Posted December 14, 2009 Originally Posted By: samandfee .....Well what makes you an Oxford scholar my learned friend...i must inform you that i am not scientifically illiterate by any stretch of the imagination,..and recently i took one train trip from Hong Kong to shanghai and on that journey looked out of the window at what is going up in the air from a million chimney stacks of a million colours and has been for a long time,that i can assure you is not pseudo-science and complete and utter fiction, i am fully aware of the planets smoking problem,......but show me the facts....with further reading you might also think that we are headed for the next ice age not global warming catastrophe Well I did do a science degree with a major in meteorology. Doesn't make me an Oxford scholar but I've had at least an introduction to science and it's methods with somewhat more extensive knowledge of weather and climate than the average punter out there. What qualification do you have? Not sure what your point is about your recent journey but I'd be interested in the literature that supposedly has us entering the next ice age, provide a link please. Also what facts are you after? Link to post Share on other sites
Oyuki kigan 0 Posted December 14, 2009 Author Share Posted December 14, 2009 Originally Posted By: thursday Seriously, I don't give a shit. Shit happens. My skiing will be done and then I die. My son's skiing will be done and then his generation will figure it out. And all this climate change will be small change. Give yourself a rest. This world is bigger than your ego. Sometimes shit happens, and sometimes its because we shit, and don't take responsibility for it. That attitude is repulsive. Not giving a shit is why your grandchildren will not enjoy the same benefits you have. You can't be bothered to 'give a shit' and then berate others for their ego? The world is bigger than skiing. This 'small change' is already killing people and nature off. When it gets worse, it will do a lot more. Link to post Share on other sites
s3phis 0 Posted December 14, 2009 Share Posted December 14, 2009 Been a while since I posted here...and I got slightly interested in this thread. I'm not a fanatic about the environment but it's not on my agenda as something to kill off either. From my perspective, I think this quote sums it all up for me: this world isn't something that's inherited from our parents but rather borrowed from our children (one of my old university professors for architecture). Global warming may or may not be as real as it's hyped up to be but I think we have bigger issues to address. Rather than CO2 emissions, I'm rather disgusted by the amount of rubbish we dispose of, largely plastics. Particularly in Japan, I think the garbage disposal program is flawed from the start. Most people don't even really know what's recyclable, combustible or what not and it really doesn't change the work load for the people who have to sort the rubbish anyway. Rather than band-aid fixing the problems, what needs to be done is to cut down on the amount of non-decomposable consumables. While the effects of CO2 emissions are debatable, it's an undeniable fact that our trash has no where to go and is going to be outlasting us. We have an island of our trash in the Pacific ocean and complete landscapes in China. With regards to the whole CO2 scheme, personally I'm not moved by the whole CO2 thing but rather the fact that I think it's a way to globalisation. That opens a whole new window for debate, one that's been of some interest to me for some time, and it's something that will have to be eventually done. When is just a matter of timing *shrug*. That said, it's finally started snowing in Nozawa again. It's likely to be the same as last year but we're still hoping for a dump of snow before Christmas. *salutations from Nozawa!* Link to post Share on other sites
thursday 1 Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 Oyuki, put your money where your mouth is. Stop going to the ski resorts and stop fanning that industry for the climate change it is a part of. Link to post Share on other sites
Oyuki kigan 0 Posted December 15, 2009 Author Share Posted December 15, 2009 Ah yes, the old 'you are a hypocrite if you so much as fart' arguement. If i really did that, like Ocean 11, nobody would listen anyways. Then i really WOULD be viewed as extreme, and dismissed, being irrelevant to the forum. I am trying hard to find a middle ground where we can still enjoy skiing and hot showers, without condemning our children to live in a world of little snow, no tuna or pollock, and no feasible alternative to oil. because we didn't 'give a shit'. If you really don't, then don't bother posting about how the poor countries are going to be screwed over by the climate deal, or anything else about the changing climate. Enjoy your time in Hokkaido, and give yourself some time to think of a better excuse to tell your grandchildren about why they can't enjoy the cold winters you were able to. Link to post Share on other sites
thursday 1 Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 I give a shit about what the bully boys are trying to pull over the ninnows. That's all I'm about. Fairness. Stop arguing with me, I get bored really quick. Link to post Share on other sites
Go Native 70 Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 thursday about the only thing you Chinese seem to care about is making money. Your complete disdain for the environment, human rights, etc is well known. If you have no interest in this debate then just refrain from posting in this thread. Link to post Share on other sites
thursday 1 Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 yes sir, :salute: :click heels: Link to post Share on other sites
Oyuki kigan 0 Posted December 15, 2009 Author Share Posted December 15, 2009 Woah, GN. WTF? Being Chinese has F-A to do with it, people all over the world are to blame. Especially my home country Canada. Thursday, nice caveat. Maybe you should be clearer in the future just what is worth a shit. And by all means, stop arguing. I'm not a fan either. Link to post Share on other sites
Go Native 70 Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 Sorry letting my racist attitudes come through. Sometimes just can't help it. Link to post Share on other sites
greg 4 Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 Originally Posted By: thursday "in particular" see grammitical nonsense thread. Why be rude? I just don't get some of you guys on these sites. If you don't agree that is fine. Place up and alternative to discuss. It's a shame forums can breed cowards, knocking people and hiding a thousand miles away...gutless. Link to post Share on other sites
Jynxx 4 Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 No one's perfect, but it becomes very apparent that some people are narrow minded. Just amazes me that some people actually believe in science, like as a modern day religion, lack the brain to understand and criticize others categorically as "dumb" when they have no understanding about the subject they are talking about. And again, we are all a***holes and dickheaded but have acquired the taste to be diplomatic about it. Again, I recommend getting counseling or at least do us and yourself a favour as to not treat someone as you wouldn't like yourself to be treated. ( Haven't you ever been told? Never had a real education huh? just a piece of paper from Uni) Link to post Share on other sites
iiyamadude 6 Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 Quote: but it becomes very apparent that some people are narrow minded I would replace the 'some' with 'lots of' or even 'most' there. Link to post Share on other sites
thursday 1 Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 Originally Posted By: Gtrain Originally Posted By: thursday "in particular" see grammitical nonsense thread. Why be rude? I just don't get some of you guys on these sites. If you don't agree that is fine. Place up and alternative to discuss. It's a shame forums can breed cowards, knocking people and hiding a thousand miles away...gutless. gutless for just pointing out your "imparticular" should be "in particluar"? If you find that offensive, don't watch television. Put me on ignore you whimp. Link to post Share on other sites
Go Native 70 Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 What has amazed me over the years of taking an active interest in all things weather and climate related is just how many people have very strong and definite views on climate even though they have absolutley no idea what they are talking about, no qualifications whatsoever or experience working in the field. Not so much on this site but I do participate in discussions on numerous weather forums and it's crazy how many people claim to have more insight into climate change than those who've devoted their lives to study and research in the field. And Jynxx not sure if you are referring to me when talking about 'people believing in science like a religion'? For me the beauty of science is that it is the complete opposite of religion. It does not require you to accept anything on faith, it provides proof to back up any claims. It also welcomes criticism and review and in fact peer review is essential if you want something published. A belief in science or being a sceptic is not about being narrow minded. I'm personally open to anything but you must be able to provide proof. Don't expect me to believe in things based on faith, myth or heresay or the crazed writings on some website. Link to post Share on other sites
greg 4 Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 Originally Posted By: thursday Originally Posted By: Gtrain Originally Posted By: thursday "in particular" see grammitical nonsense thread. Why be rude? I just don't get some of you guys on these sites. If you don't agree that is fine. Place up and alternative to discuss. It's a shame forums can breed cowards, knocking people and hiding a thousand miles away...gutless. gutless for just pointing out your "imparticular" should be "in particluar"? If you find that offensive, don't watch television. Put me on ignore you whimp. If that was your only intention, then I have misunderstood and my response was over the top. So for that...I apologise...sorry. I do find it rude however, to correct people’s gramma in a social situation even if you are correct. Mocking people is just not cool. If you are cool with that I am happy to move on to better coversations. Link to post Share on other sites
MrSingh 0 Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 Originally Posted By: thursday Seriously, I don't give a shit. Shit happens. My skiing will be done and then I die. My son's skiing will be done and then his generation will figure it out. And all this climate change will be small change. Give yourself a rest. This world is bigger than your ego. What if your son decides to be a boarder? Will you give a shit then? Link to post Share on other sites
samandfee 1 Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 OK life is too short for debating this on a forum....but lets take 1 square kilometer of sky....[atmosphere] and we want to get rid of the carbon dioxide that we humans are putting up there OK... Lets wander across it...The first 770 meters are Nitrogen The Next 210 are oxygen =980m.......OK 2o left....the next 10 are water vapour...=10 left. 9 meters are Argon...= 1 meter left Of that 1 meter 62% of many numerous gases in very small amounts.[too numerous to list here]...=38mm or 38% of last meter is all carbon Dioxide ......of which 97% of that occurs naturally.{Mother Nature that is].....OK 12mm of last meter put up there by humans.....Australia share is about 0.18 of 1mm.........12mm of 1km the polluting human puts up there about half an inch....Hmmmmmmmmm. Link to post Share on other sites
thursday 1 Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 think you've got your units mixed up. And 38mm is not 38% of a metre. Grade C, please correct and re-submit. Link to post Share on other sites
samandfee 1 Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 oops should have been cm......typo sorry thats 38cm Link to post Share on other sites
HelperElfMissy 42 Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 There should be some relatively simple solutions to these issues - we just need to think outside the box. How did China make it snow on Beijing recently ... that was a problematic result of seeding of some sort... I wonder if a bit more of that across the world will help with warming issues. Significant temperature drops have also been observed after volcanic eruptions have sent sulfur spewing into the atmosphere. Not a lot of sulfur is required to effect a global temperature drop, and there are a number of possible ways of seeding the atmosphere without harm that have been proposed. They don't earn the governments of the world much in the way of CO2 taxes though do they?! I like to do my bit to reduce, reuse, recycle where I can - I think that is good practice. However I also think a bit of innovation/lateral thinking and openness to 'outside the box' will produce a solution for us. Link to post Share on other sites
greg 4 Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 It's good to use examples like that as it can put things in perspective,using that example however, how much of that 1km did CFC's make up in the 1990's? .005mm? No one will argue the impact of the little bit of gas from air conditioners and fridges had on the atmosphere. I do believe however the ETS is the wrong way to go for Australia. Link to post Share on other sites
samandfee 1 Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 Well no insults yet.......pity i can't type,i think typists do a far better job than i can.......Agree with Gtrain on that one {today},??? Mamabear good practice indeed, we all should do our bit. Thursday you passed the test...you read it.{belated remark} Myself, i have been interested in volcanic activity for some years and its relationship with world climate.......hopefully we dont get a real big one,the human industrialised worlds blame may pale into insignificance. Link to post Share on other sites
Go Native 70 Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 However small the total percentage of it's atmospheric composition CO2 plays a major role as a 'greenhouse' gas. Greenhouse gases are those that absorb infrared radiation emitted from the earths surface. Any surface above absolute zero (-273 degrees) emits long wave radiation mostly in the infrared range. These gases then heat the surrounding atmosphere and emit infrared radiation in all directions including back toward the earths surface. Without these gases the earth would be a significantly cooler place. CO2 accounts for up to a quarter of the total greenhouse effect that keeps our planet relatively warm. As samandfee points out the human contribution to current levels of CO2 is somewhere between 3 and 5%. Is it the human contribution that is pushing CO2 levels to increase so much over the last 150 years or are there numerous other natural factors involved? Is the extra we're contributing breaking the natural threshold of the sinks which absorb CO2? It's pretty much impossible to say with 100% certainty. There is a reasonable possibility though that we are a significant factor in rapidly increasing CO2 concentrations in the atmosphere and as snow enthusiasts it's in all of our interests to help ensure the earth doesn't become too much warmer! And samandfee currently volcanic output of CO2 is only about 1% of the output by humans. Personally I am hoping for a big volcanic erruption, or anything that will help tip us back into an ice age! Then we can really have an endless winter Link to post Share on other sites
best skier in hakuba 5 Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 Back to topic, how do balls grow? Link to post Share on other sites
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