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Why when 40cm of snowfall is reported, the actual depth is always a lot more? 40cm is about halfway up my shin. But when I've skied the day after a 40cm dump, snow's been well over my knees. More like 80cm to 100cm. Lifts opening late from having to be dug out.

 

How do they actually measure the snowfall? Is it compacted in some way to be reported as 40cm?

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Interesting question,

I think it's the point of reference. Where they have decided to measure it at.

We know at a place would be snowing heavier than a place that is 100m away. Wind can carry it. Incline of landscape will change the concentration per unit area.

I think snow conditions are very generalized. When the report say powder, it can be anything. What is powder then?

We are not like Eskimos and lack the vocabulary to express snow.

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To me it seems that in Japan resorts often report lower dephts than the actual ones. Especially after a big dump. Of course it always depends on where they measure, but generally I have the feeling that they don´t measure at the deepest spots. Austrian ski resorts do the exactly opposite thing. I have skied at places that reported 150cm snow depth, but actually there where only about 30cm.

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That happens at the tal, lower parts of the mountain and high traffic area.

or are we talking about when they say it's 150 cm the actual new powder is only the top 30cm and it's hard base underneath?

actually, also happens when the slope is steep. Then it's a matter of per unit area concentration of snowfall.

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Originally Posted By: Schneebrettmann
By the way, is this a live report? If yes, where are you?

Sadly not. But it mystified me last season when I started closely checking forecasts. 40cm doesn't sound like that much but in my experience was always a ridiculously large amount of snow.
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Very interesting!!!

 

We have the same complaint here with the weather. On a day when the thermometer is reading 36oC the weather will report that it only reached 29o or 30o. The reasoning behind this is that the temperature for the gold coast region is taken at the seaway which is on the sea wall with a beautiful sea breeze HENCE it keeps the tourist happy as they think it is only 30o instead of a very uncomfortable 36o. Lovely and tropical NOT!!!

 

Guess that doesn't work in the ski fields as big dumps are more likely to make the tourists happy wakaranai

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Yeah, That happens on the glaciers ...

It was 110 cm and still at one place there were rocks underneath I couldn't see and scraped my board. I think in Tirol it's best to have at least 200 cm

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Resorts in Canada & America report the overnight snowfall at mid mountain, not sure about all resorts in Japan but Niseko reports what falls at the base of the mountain which is significantly less than up top.

Snowfall reporting is serious business in Nth America, have a look at Alta in Utah's snowfall history - they explicitly measure everything from depth to water content, density, temperature ect.

Japan doesn't take it quite as seriously and a fair bit of under reporting goes on.

Wind loading and drifting due to natural terrain features and aspect also account for big differences.

Also depends on whether the 40cm has fallen on a powder base from the day before.

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but unless they are actually out on the mountain and physically measuring the data they won't know. Its unlikely that the Met Office has the manpowere (or the will) to do that. The Met will only predict and then probably gather reported readings from various places.

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We have the same problem in Oz. The "official" snow depth recorder is nowhere near (well a couple of kilometers away from) the main NSW ski-jo. That means that the resorts can basically tell us whatever they want with no fear of contradiction.

 

Luckily, we have a dedicated snow site that operates (some) and/or rents live cameras with a refresh rate in the order of once per hour. So, if you want to know what is REALLY happening, you go to the "snowcams" and look. Better than relying on the official snow measurements.

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back home, you have to be ready to drop everything and go when the snow is on, so obviously reliable reports are needed. This however isn't always the case, one time the UK Met said that it was gonna be mega snow over Glencoe and that the next day the conditions would be epic, so rather then go to our nearby hill, Glenshee which is only about an hour away, we trekked across to the west coast of Scotland (still not actually THAT far), with all the tiny 19th Century winding lanes that pass for roads it took us about 3-4hrs to get to Glencoe. When we got there.......conditions were crap, the guaranteed snow hadn't materialised as it totally passed over Glencoe and dumped on the Cairngorms and, you've guessed it, Glenshee!! doh

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I've skied on Box Hill, Surry for a day, happened two years in a 5 year period. That was lucky. Even took my ski to school and went home down the hill in Wimbledon. I bet it was First Descent.

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Originally Posted By: JA
Luckily, we have a dedicated snow site that operates (some) and/or rents live cameras with a refresh rate in the order of once per hour. So, if you want to know what is REALLY happening, you go to the "snowcams" and look. Better than relying on the official snow measurements.

Nice, cams are the way to go! With a measuring stick in view and historical screen shots option, they could give accurate data.
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As people have mentioned, most places only measure the snow at the top, and at the base, so anywhere between those areas is anyone's guess. Plus with the uneven distribution of snow due to the winds, it's nigh on impossible to geta uniform measurement.

 

Remember last February in Niigata, there was a huge dump overnight, something like 50cms alone outside the hotel we were staying at but Kagura were reporting a mere 20cms. Suffice to say, when we hit the main slopel, it was a lot more than 20cms.

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I can't remember a 50cm, perhaps you dreamt it. I know I did. wink

 

I never really give much credit to Kagura/Naeba snow depths. They seem to just put what they think looks best!

 

For the most honest reports direct from a resort in this region - Iwappara. Warts and all, no conveniently forgetting to mention rain or undesirable info. I really respect that.

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