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Blu-Ray vs HD-DVD: And the winner is....


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 Originally Posted By: Tubby Beaver
In english ;\) what does this mean to the DVD's I have in the house? Does it mean I have to bin all my disc's and start from scratch again?


No it doesn't TB. That's what I'm said before. HD DVD and BRD players are all compatible with standard DVD. Some of them will take standard DVD and "upscale" the video to HD resolution. My bet is some of the HD DVD players will be going for a song.
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>Either way I not getting a Blu-ray player until I get a TV that can do it justice.

 

I was looking at the new flat screen tvs in Yodobashi last week, damn they are sweet! Everything about them is nice, aside from the cost. WIll Blue Ray machines be region free as well??

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 Originally Posted By: SG
 Originally Posted By: tripitaka

Before you start talking about HVD, it's a good idea to start thinking about content.


true, but you could put the entire Seinfield series on one HVD :-)
When they figure out an HVD-R or the like, that will be something.



That's a good point but a rather trifling one when it comes to the development of a new format. You could probably get the entire series of Seinfeld on a BRD.
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 Originally Posted By: Creek Boy
>Either way I not getting a Blu-ray player until I get a TV that can do it justice.

I was looking at the new flat screen tvs in Yodobashi last week, damn they are sweet! Everything about them is nice, aside from the cost. WIll Blue Ray machines be region free as well??


HDTVs are getting down below 100K yen even for 32" and 37". BRD is not region free.
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 Originally Posted By: Creek Boy
really? damn, I never knew that... Thanks Captain Obvious \:\)


If you're going to buy a house, you don't want to be splurging too much up on flat screens. Get the damn mortgage paid off before anything else. You married with kids??
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Tripit - certainly is. Buying property in Japan is probably the cheapest (re interest rates) and easiest to get in the modern world.

 

And thank bloody god that the Ray vs Hd war is over.

 

Some one had to lose - didn't they think about that?

 

Now I might invest later on.

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Back on the Blu-Ray vs HD-DVD: it is not OFFICIALLY over.

 

Toshiba Announces Discontinuation of HD DVD Businesses

19 February, 2008

 

Company Remains Focused on Championing Consumer Access to High Definition Content

 

TOKYO--Toshiba Corporation today announced that it has undertaken a thorough review of its overall strategy for HD DVD and has decided it will no longer develop, manufacture and market HD DVD players and recorders. This decision has been made following recent major changes in the market. Toshiba will continue, however, to provide full product support and after-sales service for all owners of Toshiba HD DVD products.

 

HD DVD was developed to offer consumers access at an affordable price to high-quality, high definition content and prepare them for the digital convergence of tomorrow where the fusion of consumer electronics and IT will continue to progress.

 

"We carefully assessed the long-term impact of continuing the so-called 'next-generation format war' and concluded that a swift decision will best help the market develop," said Atsutoshi Nishida, President and CEO of Toshiba Corporation. "While we are disappointed for the company and more importantly, for the consumer, the real mass market opportunity for high definition content remains untapped and Toshiba is both able and determined to use our talent, technology and intellectual property to make digital convergence a reality."

 

Toshiba will continue to lead innovation, in a wide range of technologies that will drive mass market access to high definition content. These include high capacity NAND flash memory, small form factor hard disk drives, next generation CPUs, visual processing, and wireless and encryption technologies. The company expects to make forthcoming announcements around strategic progress in these convergence technologies.

 

Toshiba will begin to reduce shipments of HD DVD players and recorders to retail channels, aiming for cessation of these businesses by the end of March 2008. Toshiba also plans to end volume production of HD DVD disk drives for such applications as PCs and games in the same timeframe, yet will continue to make efforts to meet customer requirements. The company will continue to assess the position of notebook PCs with integrated HD DVD drives within the overall PC business relative to future market demand.

 

This decision will not impact on Toshiba's commitment to standard DVD, and the company will continue to market conventional DVD players and recorders. Toshiba intends to continue to contribute to the development of the DVD industry, as a member of the DVD Forum, an international organization with some 200 member companies, committed to the discussion and defining of optimum optical disc formats for the consumer and the related industries.

 

Toshiba also intends to maintain collaborative relations with the companies who joined with Toshiba in working to build up the HD DVD market, including Universal Studios, Paramount Pictures, and DreamWorks Animation and major Japanese and European content providers on the entertainment side, as well as leaders in the IT industry, including Microsoft, Intel, and HP. Toshiba will study possible collaboration with these companies for future business opportunities, utilizing the many assets generated through the development of HD DVD.

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 Originally Posted By: tripitaka
Yes, but I don't think a PS3 will upscale standard-def video to 1080p. And even if it does, I doubt that the scaler will be as good as those found in stand-alone players.


I may be wrong but I think it does. It certainly does the upscaling and the PS3 BluRay player has had a lot of rave-reviews. It is not the crappy player that the DVD was in the PS2 when it launched thats for sure.
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 Originally Posted By: klingon
 Originally Posted By: tripitaka
Yes, but I don't think a PS3 will upscale standard-def video to 1080p. And even if it does, I doubt that the scaler will be as good as those found in stand-alone players.


I may be wrong but I think it does. It certainly does the upscaling and the PS3 BluRay player has had a lot of rave-reviews. It is not the crappy player that the DVD was in the PS2 when it launched thats for sure.


I'm wrong. The PS3 does upscale to 1080p. Not sure about the quality though.
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A lot of guys here have been buying the PS3 this past week. Coupled with their HD TVs and Sony's 3BRDs for the price of 2, they are shifting a lot of hardware and software.

 

Apparently the display quality has taken a quantum leap. And so it should.

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 Originally Posted By: thursday.
A lot of guys here have been buying the PS3 this past week. Coupled with their HD TVs and Sony's 3BRDs for the price of 2, they are shifting a lot of hardware and software.

Apparently the display quality has taken a quantum leap. And so it should.


Yes, but Sony is going to struggle to put a high-quality scaler into the PS3 without cannibalizing its (and other Blu-ray licensors) stand-along player. I'm sure the native 1080p resolution is fantastic through a PS3, just not the scaled standard-def stuff.
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 Originally Posted By: big-will
Is the scaler hardware or firmware? I'm sure they originally updated it to have that functionality via firmware. Though I may be totally wrong.


A scaler is part of an integrated circuit, but I've never heard of it being capable of being updated by firmware. It's a very complex process that cannot be changed by a software update.
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Really?

 

 Quote:
When the PlayStation 3 launched, the reviews could best be described as tepid, as the functionality and many promised features just weren't there. But we live in an age of online updates and changing firmware; with this week's 1.80 firmware update, the PlayStation 3 has become a very impressive piece of A/V goodness. The features are finally starting to catch up with the promise of the hardware, which is to say that the PS3 is now coming into its own.

 

The biggest fix is that Blu-ray discs can now run in 720p. This is an overdue improvement and clears up one of the things that has held the system back from being the best Blu-ray player value out there. Now anyone with an HDTV need not worry about resolution compatibility issues.

 

For home theater enthusiasts, the new upscaling options make this update a truly beautiful thing. I put in Lord of the Rings and then Star Wars Episode III and was impressed in both cases. You can't make something out of nothing, even with upscaling, so don't expect dropped jaws and Blu-ray-like visuals. What you will get is a solid improvement in image quality over standard DVD—as good as I've seen on most standalone players.

 

The PlayStation 3 will now be my standard DVD player in the wake of this update, and while that shouldn't make you want to run out and buy one—a standalone upscaling player is pretty cheap these days—being able to reduce the hardware clutter in your home entertainment center is something to be happy about. Keep in mind that the upscaling feature is only available via HDMI, so those using component connections won't see a benefit.

 

The 1.80 update does have the effect of making the HDMI port less of a bullet point on the back of the box, instead turning it into something that adds new capabilities to the system. The new features for high-end televisions and future televisions are certainly impressive. From the change log:

 

[bD 1080p 24 Hz Output (HDMI)] has been added as an option under [bD/DVD Settings].

[RGB Full Range (HDMI)] has been added as an option under [Display Settings].

[Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr Super White (HDMI)] has been added as an option under [Display Settings].

[bit Mapping (Super Audio CD)] has been added as an option under [Music Settings].

 

PSone and PlayStation 2 upscaling

The PSone and PS2 game upscaling is a little more complicated. First, you have to keep the game set at 480i in order to take advantage of it; change the game's settings to progressive scan, and the system defaults the resolution to 480p. (Apparently the game software overrides the hardware.) Upping the resolution can also add a window effect with black bars on all sides of the pictures. There is an option to force full screen, but you may want to try the different stretch modes of your television as well to see what gives you the least distortion.

 

That's the downside to having all these options: you are going to want to experiment a bit to see what makes your favorite games look good. Turn on the smoothing option and some games look better; others suffer. There isn't a "one-size fits all" solution, and while that may annoy the casual gamer (who may never notice the subtle differences), it's going to make home theater fans happy as they tweak the image for each game.

 

After a morning of experimentation and reading up on the subject, I see many differing opinions online: everyone's display has different-quality scalers, handles resolutions differently, and just plain looks different. It's hard to provide a definitive guide for all the new PlayStation 3 functionality, simply because everyone is going to have a different experience using the features with their television. After I spent some time fiddling around, PSone and PS2 games looked great using the PS3's upscaling on my set.

 

Better upscaling and the appearance of Guitar Hero 2 on the Xbox 360 means that I can finally put my PS2 back in the box.

 

DNLA streaming

Sony's 1.80 firmware update also offers support for the Digital Living Network Alliance (DLNA) streaming protocol. It's not complicated: I installed the free trial of TwonkyMedia to check it out, and my PS3 picked it up with no problems. Windows Media Player 11 should also work fine for content streaming. In minutes I was browsing my pictures and listening to my songs—all of which were stored on my PC—on my PS3. This is a powerful piece of functionality and will make the PlayStation 3's star rise in my household. I enjoy things that just work, and this couldn't get much simpler. There are apparently also ways of getting live transcoding to work through programs like Nero MediaHome, but without testing I can't vouch for the performance.

 

Sony wanted to make a high-quality Blu-ray player, media center, and game machine, and at launch it had failed. The games still have a ways to go before the system becomes a must-buy, but with this update, the media capabilities of the system can't be denied; the 720p fix makes this an incredible bargain just as a Blu-ray player. This is a very impressive leap in such a short amount of time, and I can't wait to see what Sony has for us next.

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 Originally Posted By: klingon
Really?

 Quote:
When the PlayStation 3 launched, the reviews could best be described as tepid, as the functionality and many promised features just weren't there. But we live in an age of online updates and changing firmware; with this week's 1.80 firmware update, the PlayStation 3 has become a very impressive piece of A/V goodness. The features are finally starting to catch up with the promise of the hardware, which is to say that the PS3 is now coming into its own.

The biggest fix is that Blu-ray discs can now run in 720p. This is an overdue improvement and clears up one of the things that has held the system back from being the best Blu-ray player value out there. Now anyone with an HDTV need not worry about resolution compatibility issues.

For home theater enthusiasts, the new upscaling options make this update a truly beautiful thing. I put in Lord of the Rings and then Star Wars Episode III and was impressed in both cases. You can't make something out of nothing, even with upscaling, so don't expect dropped jaws and Blu-ray-like visuals. What you will get is a solid improvement in image quality over standard DVD—as good as I've seen on most standalone players.

The PlayStation 3 will now be my standard DVD player in the wake of this update, and while that shouldn't make you want to run out and buy one—a standalone upscaling player is pretty cheap these days—being able to reduce the hardware clutter in your home entertainment center is something to be happy about. Keep in mind that the upscaling feature is only available via HDMI, so those using component connections won't see a benefit.

The 1.80 update does have the effect of making the HDMI port less of a bullet point on the back of the box, instead turning it into something that adds new capabilities to the system. The new features for high-end televisions and future televisions are certainly impressive. From the change log:

[bD 1080p 24 Hz Output (HDMI)] has been added as an option under [bD/DVD Settings].
[RGB Full Range (HDMI)] has been added as an option under [Display Settings].
[Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr Super White (HDMI)] has been added as an option under [Display Settings].
[bit Mapping (Super Audio CD)] has been added as an option under [Music Settings].

PSone and PlayStation 2 upscaling
The PSone and PS2 game upscaling is a little more complicated. First, you have to keep the game set at 480i in order to take advantage of it; change the game's settings to progressive scan, and the system defaults the resolution to 480p. (Apparently the game software overrides the hardware.) Upping the resolution can also add a window effect with black bars on all sides of the pictures. There is an option to force full screen, but you may want to try the different stretch modes of your television as well to see what gives you the least distortion.

That's the downside to having all these options: you are going to want to experiment a bit to see what makes your favorite games look good. Turn on the smoothing option and some games look better; others suffer. There isn't a "one-size fits all" solution, and while that may annoy the casual gamer (who may never notice the subtle differences), it's going to make home theater fans happy as they tweak the image for each game.

After a morning of experimentation and reading up on the subject, I see many differing opinions online: everyone's display has different-quality scalers, handles resolutions differently, and just plain looks different. It's hard to provide a definitive guide for all the new PlayStation 3 functionality, simply because everyone is going to have a different experience using the features with their television. After I spent some time fiddling around, PSone and PS2 games looked great using the PS3's upscaling on my set.

Better upscaling and the appearance of Guitar Hero 2 on the Xbox 360 means that I can finally put my PS2 back in the box.

DNLA streaming
Sony's 1.80 firmware update also offers support for the Digital Living Network Alliance (DLNA) streaming protocol. It's not complicated: I installed the free trial of TwonkyMedia to check it out, and my PS3 picked it up with no problems. Windows Media Player 11 should also work fine for content streaming. In minutes I was browsing my pictures and listening to my songs—all of which were stored on my PC—on my PS3. This is a powerful piece of functionality and will make the PlayStation 3's star rise in my household. I enjoy things that just work, and this couldn't get much simpler. There are apparently also ways of getting live transcoding to work through programs like Nero MediaHome, but without testing I can't vouch for the performance.

Sony wanted to make a high-quality Blu-ray player, media center, and game machine, and at launch it had failed. The games still have a ways to go before the system becomes a must-buy, but with this update, the media capabilities of the system can't be denied; the 720p fix makes this an incredible bargain just as a Blu-ray player. This is a very impressive leap in such a short amount of time, and I can't wait to see what Sony has for us next.


Sorry I didn't clarify myself properly. Yes, you can make updates but not on the scale of moving from 720p scaling to 1080p scaling (or actually adding scaling capabilities). The firmware adds capabilities to the general spec.

Anyway, just saw this morning that Sony has come up with bargain basement home theater A/V receivers. They're going all out for the high-def market now.
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