Rag-Doll 0 Posted January 17, 2008 Share Posted January 17, 2008 Originally Posted By: Fattwins inbounds controls are lacking in Japan. ski cutting means jack! To the extent that this comment relates to Niseko (which apparently the earlier commends did) is this what they were doing the last time you were up at Niseko? Link to post Share on other sites
thursday 1 Posted January 17, 2008 Share Posted January 17, 2008 Fatts, maybe you want to read up on the N patrol first. Niseko Patrol "They are paid a not so awe-inspiring 780 yen an hour but, if things do get a bit rough, we still expect them to be able to save our lives. Niseko has a total of 31 patrollers who are responsible for safeguarding 57 runs totaling over 47 kilometres of groomed ski slope. At the same time the same guys and girls are also looked upon to carry out rescues in over 30 square kilometres of Niseko backcountry. I shared a few beers with a group of Hirafu patrollers and asked them about their experiences, and how they feel about having such a huge backyard to look after." Link to post Share on other sites
quattro 1 Posted January 17, 2008 Share Posted January 17, 2008 Akio Shinya has been putting an avalanche report out for the Niseko area for years. He probably has the best knowledge of the mountain. http://niseko.nadare.info/ Niseko avalanche report. Updated daily Link to post Share on other sites
stemik 14 Posted January 17, 2008 Share Posted January 17, 2008 Originally Posted By: Rag-Doll Originally Posted By: Fattwins inbounds controls are lacking in Japan. ski cutting means jack! To the extent that this comment relates to Niseko (which apparently the earlier commends did) is this what they were doing the last time you were up at Niseko? my question was aimed at Patrol all over Japan and not just Niseko Link to post Share on other sites
Go Native 70 Posted January 17, 2008 Share Posted January 17, 2008 I think the fact that there has been no avalanche deaths since the inception of the Niseko Local Rules is testiment to fact that they are doing something right up here. Link to post Share on other sites
Yuki's Passion 1 Posted January 17, 2008 Share Posted January 17, 2008 Originally Posted By: Go Native I think the fact that there has been no avalanche deaths since the inception of the Niseko Local Rules is testiment to fact that they are doing something right up here. Niseko patrol are prolly the best in the country. They have taken more steps to decrease the chances of avies and learn from other countries. They brought in the head patroller of Jackson Hole a few years ago to learn from one of the best and most experienced patrollers in the world. They have also learned how to use dynamite to set off avies before opening. Now whether theyre allowed to use it is up to the Japanese govt. Im with GN - they are doing a good job up there. What scares me are the lot of punters who go there (and other resorts) and dont have the slightest clue as to avie danger. Those are the ones who will most likely get injured/set off avies IMO. Link to post Share on other sites
Fattwins 0 Posted January 17, 2008 Share Posted January 17, 2008 If you seriously believe that patrol in Japan are up to snuff then you are on crack! Thursday sorry but you dont know jack about this. Link to post Share on other sites
thursday 1 Posted January 17, 2008 Share Posted January 17, 2008 True, I don't know jack about most tings, but I respect the Niseko patrol. Calling them useless is completely the oppostie of what I would do. Link to post Share on other sites
quattro 1 Posted January 17, 2008 Share Posted January 17, 2008 The patrol in Niseko seems to have there act together compared to a lot of patrols in Japan. They may not be up to stateside standards. But overall they do a good job. Link to post Share on other sites
samurai 0 Posted January 17, 2008 Share Posted January 17, 2008 the fact that they hired a JH patroller to come out and give them some instruction says alot. The American Avalanche Institute was founded in JH. I've never been to niseko. but I would be really surprised to hear about avi control being done at any resort in Japan to the level that would recognize it as adequate. Personally, just by viewing pics of niseko, I can understand why it doesn't have many slides. and that has nothing to do with patrol. and surely, 750yen/hour doesn't initiate competition from elite paramedics or avi forecasters. (although it is a virutal mirror image of California's pay scale for paramedics.) Link to post Share on other sites
Oyuki kigan 0 Posted January 17, 2008 Share Posted January 17, 2008 What the f*ck? Where is the money going? How is a patrol supposed to function on minimum wage?!? i sure don't want the guy rescueing me sick from the instant ramen he has to live on. If they can't pay more than that, how are the patrollers supposed to get real training? Link to post Share on other sites
spook 0 Posted January 17, 2008 Share Posted January 17, 2008 that is an insanely low amount for an hourly wage. by way of comparison, what is the pay rate for a ski/snoboar instructor? oyuki - i'm not referring to you specifically here, but industry standard rates Link to post Share on other sites
Oyuki kigan 0 Posted January 17, 2008 Share Posted January 17, 2008 i don't even know how much i get paid. Its paid in a lump sum at the end of the season at the place i work. I just do it for the free seasons pass. When i worked for Karuizawa, it was about 2000 to 3000 yen per 2-hour lesson. But no season's pass, the bastards. thats why i hate that place. Link to post Share on other sites
Fattwins 0 Posted January 17, 2008 Share Posted January 17, 2008 Again the comment is about every resort period. cb learning how to blast isnt getting a firecracker and throwing it into the snow. http://www2.worksafebc.com/publications/OHSRegulation/GuidelinePart21.asp#SectionNumber:G21.7 Cortina had some good patrol but they have turned over almost the whole staff in 3 years time. 32 patrollers is way under international standards of how to keep a mountain safe. Telling people patrol does a good job, but not understanding what the job is also crap. Link to post Share on other sites
Yuki's Passion 1 Posted January 17, 2008 Share Posted January 17, 2008 Originally Posted By: thursday. Fatts, maybe you want to read up on the N patrol first. Niseko Patrol thats a bollox article showing nothing thursday about the changes going on in Niseko. In fact, it makes them look pretty ghey.. Fatts, youre right, no patrol in Japan is up to International standards on prolly any level, but theyre still the best around IMO. Since you obviously no little about the Niseko patrol why dont you enlighten us as to why the Cortina patrol are/were the best IYO, preeeeze... Link to post Share on other sites
Fattwins 0 Posted January 17, 2008 Share Posted January 17, 2008 I dont believe cortina is the best mate at all just said good. This isnt about Niseko this is about how much you trust your patrol to tell you it wont slide in prone areas! Link to post Share on other sites
thursday 1 Posted January 17, 2008 Share Posted January 17, 2008 Originally Posted By: Creek Boy thats a bollox article showing nothing thursday about the changes going on in Niseko. In fact, it makes them look pretty ghey.. What chew talking about? It told me there are only 4 on patrol in Hana and I should avoid going there like the plague. Link to post Share on other sites
Rag-Doll 0 Posted January 17, 2008 Share Posted January 17, 2008 The article is 7 years old. Have things not changed (for the better) since then? Link to post Share on other sites
SnowJapan Admin SnowJapan 177 Posted January 17, 2008 SnowJapan Admin Share Posted January 17, 2008 CB if you mean the one on this site, yes it is quite old - 7 years old in fact. Is it really that "bollox", even considering it from our archives of articles? Personally I think it is very interesting to read back from 7 years ago and see how things have changed and think it is definitely worth keeping them up there. Link to post Share on other sites
bellavista 0 Posted January 18, 2008 Share Posted January 18, 2008 Whilst I completely agree with GN that avies are rare in Niseko, they do occur. I've seen a ski buddy get carried into some trees over above the Hano golf course/ jackson's area. There were a number of cornice collapses in Annupuri bowls last week. All you need is a small terrain trap and you're in some trouble. For the amount of snow Niseko gets, it is very stable.There's thankfully not a lot of freeze/thaw cycling. The slopes straight off the peak are getting up toward ideal avy slope angle. If the same amounts fell in Colorado, there would be carnage. I find the avi info in Niseko a good guide, but I couldn't say with authority how good the patrol are. I have taken to always wearing a transceiver now. it's just too easy to put it on and forget about it. If I know I'm going further afield, I obviously take the full setup. In niseko, you often end up venturing just that little bit further away from the lifts. This article converted me to regular transceiver usage. http://www.skiersjournal.com/index2.php?option=com_content&do_pdf=1&id=120 Link to post Share on other sites
neversummer 0 Posted January 18, 2008 Share Posted January 18, 2008 Nice article and shows the value of having one Link to post Share on other sites
Hornster 0 Posted January 18, 2008 Author Share Posted January 18, 2008 Excellent point! It is so easy to strap on your transceiver, set it to transmit and forget about it for the rest of the day. Niseko may not get many avalanches but they DO still occur. Link to post Share on other sites
HelperElfMissy 42 Posted January 18, 2008 Share Posted January 18, 2008 How many times do you have a car accident? But do you click in your seatbelt in the driveway every trip? Maybe not you - but I buckle up probably 99.5% of the time - and I have had one low speed car accident in 21 years of driving. If you are good enough on a board or ski's to venture into the Back Country then you are skilled enough to ride with a transciever, a backpack with gear, and some avie knowledge. Me ? ...umm..... no ... if I wore a back pack I would just fall on it which is why I am playing in the ungroomed stuff inbounds. Maybe next year. Link to post Share on other sites
thursday 1 Posted January 18, 2008 Share Posted January 18, 2008 I buckle up 100% of the time. The backpack is too useful to not have one. But now I have a Dakine Sequence which is HUGE, just wondering how I'd manage with all the lenses inside getting off the lift. Oh, there was a Mizuhno article about dynamite blasting at Higashiyama on that site. Can't seem to find it. Yes, they are doing it the American way now. Maybe "Niseko Higashiyama Resort" can post it up Link to post Share on other sites
Hornster 0 Posted January 18, 2008 Author Share Posted January 18, 2008 I buckle up every time I get in the car and I ALWAYS carry my avie gear with me if I know that I am going off-piste. What I like about Niseko (apart from fantastic powder) is that there is plenty powder runs to be found inbounds without having to worry about the hazards involved with off-piste skiing. Link to post Share on other sites
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