Keeping warm?

[fjef 0]

At my wife's PTA meeting this week, it was announced that due to the extreme increase in the cost of kerosene (it has more than doubled in the last 2 years), it is now cheaper to turn on your electric heaters and ditch the kero heaters.

 

Our air-cons double as electric heaters and this is the first winter in 20 years in Japan that we have started to use air-cons for heaters because they are cheaper to run. Until now Kero fan heaters were the way to go.

 

What are you doing to keep warm this winter?

[Tubby Beaver 209]

I use a Kero heater, dunno how much it used to cost, but I reckon that its pretty cheap. 1500 yen fills up a huge can and that was 3 weeks ago and I still have about a third of it left. Nice and warm, BUT they are a bit smelly and having to open the window for fumes isn't very efficient

[sunrise 0]

wow, it's that bad....! I use gas and electric carpets.

[stemik 14]

 Originally Posted By: fjef

At my wife's PTA meeting this week, it was announced that due to the extreme increase in the cost of kerosene (it has more than doubled in the last 2 years), it is now cheaper to turn on your electric heaters and ditch the kero heaters.

Our air-cons double as electric heaters and this is the first winter in 20 years in Japan that we have started to use air-cons for heaters because they are cheaper to run. Until now Kero fan heaters were the way to go.

What are you doing to keep warm this winter?

very interesting - i mentioned this to my wife just the other day that maybe the aircon is cheaper now...our aircon is 220v...does this mean more costs?

[fjef 0]

No - my understanding is that 220V appliances are slightly cheaper in most cases - that is why 220V circuits exist in most Japanese homes for running major appliances - but there might be other factors like the age of the machine and the condition that it is in that have more influence over the cost of running it.

[NoFakie 45]

Don't want to sound too nerdy here, but I think this will depend on what kind of electric heat you're using and what the temperature is outside.

 

What I think they want to say is that a modern wall-installed air conditioner is cheaper than kero. The point being than an air conditioner is a heat pump, not a heater. Its like a fridge running in reverse. It takes heat from the air outside and dumps it indoors. Moving heat from one place to another (through exchange) is much less work (=energy=cost) than trying to heat something. The number that shows how effective your air-con is the COP (coefficient of performance). This is typically around 4 for a heat pump. Which means that an air con will get you four times as much heat as a simple element based heater, like an electric bar heater or hot carpet.

 

When the outside temp falls, the heat pump has to do more work to get heat from outside. In cold areas, an electric heat pump air con won't work very well. There's one in the place I rent but its totally ineffective when it gets subzero.

 

Electric bar heaters and electric carpets are still going to be way more expensive than kero. A typical kero stove might be rated at 3kW but will only use 0.32 litres an hour. 3kWh of electricity is what, 67 yen? 0.32 litres of toyu is still around 30yen.

 

If your house is well-built, another good way to heat your it with electricity is a storage heater. It heats up a load of bricks overnight using very cheap power from the nuke plants that are on 24/7. Storage heaters also give you radiant heat, the best type.

 

Of course, sunlight@0 yen is best.

[stemik 14]

hey thanks Mr W. the aircon does seem to warm up the room a lot faster than the kero stove...(and its a big kero stove) so at the moment we are using both in the morning....kero stove for about 2 hours and aircon for 30mins.

 

BTW - season pass?

[indosnm 0]

Tubby, that bottle of Kero (18l) used to cost around 650 yen and that wasn't that long ago!

We don't have the gas option here, so we are using air con now and when it gets really cold, we'll crank out the kero fan heater. Got it new last year and was happy with it because it didn't smell like our older one.

[soubriquet 0]

I turn on the central heating. Doesn't everyone have central heating?

[samurai 0]

F you, soubs.

[soubriquet 0]

This winter I've set the central heating at 17 degrees. I have a tiny electric footpad under my workspace which make 17C a very comfortable temperature.

[thursday 1]

that sounds really cold.

[soubriquet 0]

17C is lovely if you are wearing warm clothes.

 

I hope the significant green people here (I don't give a rats arse who you are) are cutting well back on collective heating and concentrating on keeping yourself warm.

 

The High school chicks here have gone from short skirts and socks to short skirts, woolly tights and sensible shoes.

 

17C is easily available with entirely passive solar heating on a sunny mid-winter day. None of the environmenltalists seem to be looking to the future

[thursday 1]

This morning I was down to 12. I had a shower at 42 to unshrink the nuts.

[indosnm 0]

 Originally Posted By: soubriquet

The High school chicks here have gone from short skirts and socks to short skirts, woolly tights and sensible shoes.

Thank god it wasn't the yummies I was talking to today at the gym.
Tights on HSG are just not acceptable!

[stemik 14]

 Originally Posted By: soubriquet

This winter I've set the central heating at 17 degrees. I have a tiny electric footpad under my workspace which make 17C a very comfortable temperature.

central heating....bliss.
Actually we are thinking of changing our boiler and switching to central heating...any suggestions are very welcome

[soubriquet 0]

This system has a kero boiler piping hot water around the house. Each room has a detachable radiator(s). The radiators are programmable for temperature and timing.

 

I came of age at the precise time that the mini-skirt met stockings and suspenders. This was just before the invention of tights, and a very good time to be a young man with a bone.

[NoFakie 45]

 Originally Posted By: stemik

hey thanks Mr W. the aircon does seem to warm up the room a lot faster than the kero stove...(and its a big kero stove) so at the moment we are using both in the morning....kero stove for about 2 hours and aircon for 30mins.

 

BTW - season pass?

 

Stemikster

 

I'll get onto Homeland Security when I have a minute. It looks like Tuesday might be quite good, but I probably won't be ready by then.

 

Dunno about your stoves. The heat/kero amount will be written on them somewhere though. The price of your electricity also depends on whatever your contract is. 20 something a kWh is normal though. 7 or less if its overnight power.

 

The place we rent has kero central heating running fan heaters called "fan convectors". Its a nice system, but costs a fortune to run. Hundreds of litres a month. The fans heat up the room quickly but dry the air out much more than ordinary radiators. We're having a place built though, and that gets full sun all day. It should cost peanuts to heat.

 

Its a bit expensive, but the capilene underwear Patagonia makes is great stuff. Its really comfortable, much more than some of the other ones. It dries in no time too, which is good in winter.

[muikabochi 208]

Did we decide that the kero is cheaper then?

 

I wish the aircon was cheaper as I have 2 and they would be much preferably to the kero heaters... which not only annoy me with the smell but also the often beeping and running out at the most annoying times possible.

[Go Native 70]

We don't have aircon up here in Hokkaido (not worth it when it's only needed for a week or two at most) so it's toyu for me. We have a central heating system in my house that's fairly expensive to run but keeps the house at a really nice temp without any nasty fumes.

[Tubby Beaver 209]

why is central heating so expensive here? I can't remember it being expensive at home and we run it on gas. I do miss my central heating and double glazed flat in winter time....soooo warm!!

[stemik 14]

 Originally Posted By: Tubby Beaver

why is central heating so expensive here?

I ask myself the same question every day.

[samurai 0]

management philosophy.

 

I hate this country's management philosophy. The whole hierarchy program is preventing the national economy from actually growing.

 

I (assume) that contractors and builders think that one should have to pay more for central heating because it's modern and outside the box of tradition.

 

"It's new, so it's expensive."

 

don't get me started. I hate my job and I hate my experience with japanese office management. My school just bought new computers for all the staff... in XP because Vista is mendokusai. (they also bought new printers... so don't feed me any driver-crap.) Ironically, the computer teachers, as well as myself, also bring their own laptops because the the new system is so out of date. they too run vista.

 

I'm in a brand new apartment. BRAND NEW. and it doesn't have central heat. Why? because management can't sack up and learn something new. Does one really think that building a new apartment complex with central heating would actually cost them money?

 

"We do things this way... because we always have."

 

Oh... and I should also mention that the english text my school insists upon is 15 years old. I'm paying for my own M.A. I have friends around the world who have continuining education paid for by their school. I work for a private school. NEVER send your kids to a private school in northern Japan. I assure you, they will have toyo heaters blowing in their faces while they receive the same education as their parents received because "We've always done things this way."

 

If you have kids in Japan- find an international school.

 

(rant off)

[NoFakie 45]

 Originally Posted By: muikabochi

Did we decide that the kero is cheaper then?

I wish the aircon was cheaper as I have 2 and they would be much preferably to the kero heaters... which not only annoy me with the smell but also the often beeping and running out at the most annoying times possible.

If your aircons use heat pumps and are designed for heating at Niigata temps (kanreichi-shiyou), they could well be cheaper than kero. Try phoning the manufacturer.

I suppose central heating is expensive in Japan because all the gas and kero is imported in ships, not pipes, and distributed in tank lorries and bottles, not pipes. If you do fit a system, don't install a combined central heating/hot water boiler. You'll pay way over the odds for hot water outside the heating season. That's the main problem in the place I rent.

[Go Native 70]

Yeah we have a separate boiler for our hot water that runs off gas. We also installed a commercial oven/cooktop in our kitchen. And because it's a commercial oven we had to (for some ridiculous reason) have a commercial gas supply so for our little house we have 3 of the large gas tanks! Reckon we'll go a few years before our gas will need replacing...