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I really like Japan BUT........


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 Quote:
Originally posted by farquah:
Mantas-Just get one of your Australian personalities killed by one and am sure the public would do the rest!! ;\) :p
bulb.gif Brilliant! Who did you have in mind?... Ray Martin maybe?

I reckon we humans could almost put every animal on earth into three categories

1) Scenery
2) Food
3) Vermin.

And their right to life is about in that order as well.
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Today is the second day they've had whale in the kyoushoku (school lunch)... it was a bit disgusting... Guess they are trying to promote it. I can't understand that a country like Japan who is usually ahead of the environmentalist movement is doing this. It seems to me that Japanese are a bit hypocritical about this. Of course, I am speaking in general. There are many millions of Japanese so I guess many are different... but anyway I wonder what the great majority thinks about this whale issue.

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All the schools within my district share the same school lunch menu, so it's not a school thing, and therefore I think it's better to contact the BOE. I've spoken to the teachers about it already during lunch and they said that in the past they were not allowed to serve it, but recently it has become "allowed" again. As you well know, it won't do any good that you write to them, but if it makes you feel better I'll PM the name of the Board of Education to you later. I know I probably don't need to say this but anyway,if you do write them don't be impolite or anything cos I have to work with this people everyday... cool.gif

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Creek Boy, if you are going to write, I suggest you Google "whalemeat heavy metals" first, and keep your approach to the health of the kids, and maybe the ecological damage of whaling (so as to avoid the get-out that number9 and other Japanese really like, ie, "Westerners are so sentimental".)

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Since I am the one who works for this BOE I think it's logical (at least in japanese terms) that it's me the one who tells them and not somebody completely unrelated. If you have any suggestions or pointers to information like O11, please post them here.

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 Quote:
Originally posted by Ocean11:
Creek Boy, if you are going to write, I suggest you Google "whalemeat heavy metals" first, and keep your approach to the health of the kids, and maybe the ecological damage of whaling (so as to avoid the get-out that number9 and other Japanese really like, ie, "Westerners are so sentimental".)
Haha, it's funny how I'm some sort of a Japanese representative \:D

Anyways, telling the longest living people on earth that their eating habits are unhealthy is, well.. good luck wave.gif
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You have a point, and the truth be told what they have at the schools is Minke whale, which is not classified as an endangered species and it's also not considered to accumulate toxins in its meat. Minke meat is read and lacks the necessary fat to store the toxins that other whales can. I'd like to hear what you guys think about this anyway...

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 Quote:
Originally posted by number9:
Anyways, telling the longest living people on earth that their eating habits are unhealthy is, well.. good luck wave.gif
Their eating habits used to be healthy hence the longevity of elderly Japanese now but the succeeding generations have been dying of cancer and other illnesses at a rate that means they won't be particularly long-lived. And whale meat has hardly been a staple of the Japanese diet at any time.

As for 'it's only Minke', it won't be soon. Catching the Minke has allowed the whaling fleets to survive to catch the other stuff later, which will be fed to kids in the future, whether they want it or not.

This from Greenpeace

-77% of the Japanese population does not support whaling in Antarctica,
-61% haven't eaten whale meat since childhood, and
-ONLY 1% eat whale meat more than once a month ... and
-Japan has more than 4.800 tones of FROZEN whale meat in storage.
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Their eating habits used to be healthy hence the longevity of elderly Japanese now but the succeeding generations have been dying of cancer and other illnesses at a rate that means they won't be particularly long-lived. And whale meat has hardly been a staple of the Japanese diet at any time.
As opposed to health crazed western nations where obesity is a massive problem to the populations' health and a huge burden to the healthcare systems. Of course Japan's not immune to this (and neither is China and other Asian nations), so in the future the Japanese population may be as round as the American/Aussie/Scottish/etc. populations.

Which nation is going to unseat Japan for longevity, and when is it scheduled to happen? I haven't read any reports indicating that Japan is about to lose it's top spot. Or do the Japanese have long life expectancy because of the superior healthcare system? (I'm sure many westerners will disagree to that.)

Anyways, whale meat has no effect on Japanese health because it's not part of the regular diet. And health problems being faced by modern day Japanese seem pretty much in line with other developed nations (though many have a headstart on the fatties, compared to Japan).
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"Or do the Japanese have long life expectancy because of the superior healthcare system? (I'm sure many westerners will disagree to that.)"

 

that is laughable. if you consider drugs which are twenty to thirty years out of date simply to protect a nationalistic monopoly agenda, doctors who needlessly push pharmaceuticals on patients in order to receive tax credits and other side deal profits, or a tendency to keep critical health information such as cancer and aids secret from the patient despite the victims having signed legally binding documents ensuring they be told of said ailments, superior, well...good luck. wave.gif

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and as for the whaling debate, maybe this

is reading you might find interesting regarding the moral dilemma. but then again, maybe it won't make a difference. it doesn't seem to with the slaughter of dolphins, or, despite the childish "kowai" culture, the ridiculous amount of fur that is ever present in fashion here.

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i'm not sure exactly where you are implying the little fish are at work buddie? the article? don't you think there is a moral dilemma with harvesting conscious creatures? and as for the "kowai" remark, don't you think that the way people refuse to make these types of connections an issue in the whaling debate? 'we love rabbits, they are cute. i will ignore the fact that i have a dead one around my shoulders' is the same as 'we love whales, they are wonderful creatures, we will fly half way across the planet to see one and marvel at it, when we arrive home we will eat one for dinner and never think twice'. don't you see a problem with that?

as for the health care system comment, person experiences have forced me to respond. sorry, lets get back to whaling.

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The red herring was for number9's health issue.

 

And the cuteness or cleverness factor has got nothing to do with anything really either. We eat all sorts of clever things. Octopuses are supposed to be really smart, as are pigs. Those of us who aren't vegetarian generally don't let that bother us too much. number9 seems quite smart, but if I was hungry enough, I'd eat him. He may even be cute.

 

The arguments against whaling are that it's not sustainable, either for the whales or for the ocean as a whole. The whalemeat is not that good for you when you've got it, and getting it requires a lot of energy.

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The toxins in whale meat was the original red herring.

 

I've heard that some non-Minke is actually pretty tasty (forgot which one), but I've never had it so I don't know.

 

Some whales are endangered, they definitely shouldn't be hunted. While some others aren't, I don't see why they can't be hunted like other game.

 

 Quote:
The arguments against whaling are that it's not sustainable, either for the whales or for the ocean as a whole. The whalemeat is not that good for you when you've got it, and getting it requires a lot of energy.
So, whaling can never be sustainable, but other game hunting can be? What makes whales more special than other animals?

 

Shouldn't the issue be about quotas per specie per nation? (For the nations that want to whale.)

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 Quote:
Originally posted by Ocean11:


As for 'it's only Minke', it won't be soon. Catching the Minke has allowed the whaling fleets to survive to catch the other stuff later.
Good point Ocean. I'm going to agree with you on that one.
It's the thin end of the wedge. In the 90's the Japanese almost fished the Northern Bluefin Tuna to extinction, except for the intervention from groups like Green Peace.

That said.

Most of us urban dwelling humans have lost a vital the connection we used to have with nature. All the meat we eat was once a living thing. To convert the animal from' alive' to 'dead', someone had too do the killing. How many of us could look into a little lambs eyes and slit it's throat? Though when we put that lovely packaged tray of lamb chops into the shopping trolley, we wouldn't give it a second thought. It's as if the packaging not only keeps the meat fresh but also negates us from any moral obligation to the animals suffering or demise.

The debate shouldn't be about whether we hunt whales or not but whether it can be done sustainably. ( and perhaps the health issues as well )

The experts suggest NO!

Whales and Dolphins- I love them, surf and swim with them, marvel at them, but if they weren't endangered and I was hungry enough. I'd eat them too.
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> So, whaling can never be sustainable,

 

Who said that? Slippery little bugger aren't you.

 

> What makes whales more special than other animals?

 

The fact that their numbers are so low that it's unknown what factors might provoke their sudden extinction.

 

> While some others aren't, I don't see why they can't be hunted like other game.

 

Because the people who are doing the hunting and the promoting of the industry can't be trusted not to add the odd species here and there just to try it on. There's still plenty out doubt that minke are out of the woods.

 

> The toxins in whale meat was the original red herring.

 

Not so. I wouldn't eat any for that reason alone, nor would I let my son eat it. If whale meat is on the menu at school for stupid political reasons alone, any potential health risk is too much.

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>> So, whaling can never be sustainable,

 

>Who said that? Slippery little bugger aren't you.

 

You, silly :p Look, from a few posts above:

 Quote:
The arguments against whaling are that it's not sustainable, either for the whales or for the ocean as a whole.
> The fact that their numbers are so low that it's unknown what factors might provoke their sudden extinction.

 

Are whales the only hunted mammals that are in this category?

 

> Not so. I wouldn't eat any for that reason alone, nor would I let my son eat it. If whale meat is on the menu at school for stupid political reasons alone, any potential health risk is too much.

 

So, do you succussfully avoid all toxins and harmful chemicals and whatnot in all food you consume? Or is this level of attention paid to only specific ingredients, like whale meat \:\)

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 Quote:
Originally posted by number9:
> The fact that their numbers are so low that it's unknown what factors might provoke their sudden extinction.

Are whales the only hunted mammals that are in this category?


What, so just because they are not the only group threatened by extinction means that we can't try to protect this group?
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