akibun 0 Posted February 10, 2006 Share Posted February 10, 2006 I heard on BBC news they say Turin, but many other place I see Torino. I'm confused!! Link to post Share on other sites
bushpig 0 Posted February 10, 2006 Share Posted February 10, 2006 Akibun, Snowglider had this to say about it in another thread: "Torino or Turin? a saw an lighthearted debate about it, if you say Naples Venice Florence Milan and Rome then to be consistent you would say Turin. If you say Napoli Venezia Firenze Milano and Roma then Torino it is." Link to post Share on other sites
quattro 1 Posted February 10, 2006 Share Posted February 10, 2006 I know a lot of places closer to the Austrian border have both a German name and an Italian name. Has to do with Austria owning parts of Italy before WW1. However I think Turin is a bit to far west. Link to post Share on other sites
bushpig 0 Posted February 10, 2006 Share Posted February 10, 2006 I'm pretty sure in this case it is just the anglicization of the name versus the original name. Link to post Share on other sites
gamera 0 Posted February 10, 2006 Share Posted February 10, 2006 Torino - Italian name Turin - French name When people use different language, place names are also different which is confusing. Especially when you travel Europe, sometimes very hard to judge if you don't used to it. e.g. Wien(German)/Vienna(English) Ljubljana(Slovenian)/Lanbach(German) København(Danish)/Copenhagen(English) Alsas-Loraine(French)/Elsass-Lothringen(German) Link to post Share on other sites
snowbender 3 Posted February 10, 2006 Share Posted February 10, 2006 Torino - Italian name Turin - French name I did not know that. Link to post Share on other sites
marnix 0 Posted February 10, 2006 Share Posted February 10, 2006 Quote: Originally posted by quattro: I know a lot of places closer to the Austrian border have both a German name and an Italian name. Has to do with Austria owning parts of Italy before WW1. The people there still speak German as their first language and Italian as their second. Link to post Share on other sites
damian 0 Posted February 11, 2006 Share Posted February 11, 2006 When I drive into Suisse from Italy, I find that Italian is the language written and spoken for a significant distance after crossing the boarder. This is due in part to the fact that I enter Suisse via a reasonably large finger of the country that juts out to the south into Italy. German language doesn't start until you leave that finger heading north. I make an effort not to Anglicize European city names, although I often forget. It comes more easily these days as my Japanese partner naturally uses the 'local' pronunciation - - Roma, Venezia, Torino etc. The only city that I continue to Anglicize is Paris, and that is because I sound like an utter tool calling it Pawee in the middle of an English sentence (and dont forget, that is Pawee with a complicated throat cleaning 'r' in the middle). Link to post Share on other sites
Thunderpants 0 Posted February 11, 2006 Share Posted February 11, 2006 Quote: Originally posted by gamera: København(Danish) But can you pronounce it? Link to post Share on other sites
Ocean11 0 Posted February 11, 2006 Share Posted February 11, 2006 It was only the other day that I realized that Torino was in fact Turin. (Sound of hand slapping forehead...) Link to post Share on other sites
nzlegend 1 Posted February 11, 2006 Share Posted February 11, 2006 yep the Torino Shroud doesnt have the same ring to it as the Turin Shroud. Growing up thinking and the names were Rome, Milan etc its hard to break the habit. I guess if I lived there I would adapt and use the correct words. Japanese with katakana seem to naturally use the correct pronuciation, its actually quite ironic when teaching them English and 'correcting' them to say the anglicized version when in fact the where totally correct in the first place. I never really thought about it before, but now I wont bat an eyelid when they say Roma. Link to post Share on other sites
damian 0 Posted February 11, 2006 Share Posted February 11, 2006 It was only early last year that realised the same as Ocean. I always thought Turin was in the middle east, ie, where jesus apparently lived and hence where his shroud would have been found. Glider - it was odd for me as well, hearing the katakana version which was of course perfectly correct. At first I thought it admirable for them to get it right, but then I remembered Shidonii.... Link to post Share on other sites
gamera 0 Posted February 11, 2006 Share Posted February 11, 2006 Quote: Originally posted by Thunderpants: Quote: Originally posted by gamera: København(Danish) But can you pronounce it? LOL Very difficult. You know I am not good at pronouncing Danish ø , German umlaut, Swedish å, Norweigian æ etc whatever like that. Too complicated Link to post Share on other sites
Weegeoff 0 Posted February 11, 2006 Share Posted February 11, 2006 gamera Well said Link to post Share on other sites
damian 0 Posted February 14, 2006 Share Posted February 14, 2006 I wonder how the London Olympics will be termed by the press etc in Italy? London Olympics or Londra Olympics. (Italians also call Berlin, Berlino) Link to post Share on other sites
gamera 0 Posted February 14, 2006 Share Posted February 14, 2006 Olimpico Londrano Link to post Share on other sites
Simon 0 Posted February 14, 2006 Share Posted February 14, 2006 Quote: Originally posted by _spud: I wonder how the London Olympics will be termed by the press etc in Italy? London Olympics or Londra Olympics. It will be Olimpiadi di Londra. As you've seen, every city name gets italianized (not even sure if such a word exists) over here. Link to post Share on other sites
damian 0 Posted February 14, 2006 Share Posted February 14, 2006 Cool! I think it happens in most languages. What is the Italianisation of Sydney? Link to post Share on other sites
number9 0 Posted February 14, 2006 Share Posted February 14, 2006 Yeah, that makes sense. But for such easily pronounceable names like Torino, it seems like a shame to localize the names. So, katakana doesn't seem so bad after all? Link to post Share on other sites
gamera 0 Posted February 14, 2006 Share Posted February 14, 2006 To describe Italian, Spanish names etc, katakana works pretty good, I guess. But if it's some other languages, things go different. For example Göteborg (Sweden) - I guess perhaps 'イェーテボリ' is the best fit for it, but still not completely the same - Thunderpants, help! Beijing (China ) - 'ベイジング' is the best fit but if they describe it in kanji, we are to pronounce it 'ペキン' Link to post Share on other sites
number9 0 Posted February 14, 2006 Share Posted February 14, 2006 But because it's in kanji, you can have written communication much more easily with the Chinese than non-kanji users. That's the beauty of kanji languages. Link to post Share on other sites
bushpig 0 Posted February 14, 2006 Share Posted February 14, 2006 yeah, but it used to be Peking in English too. That is the pinyin vs the other one (hehe) system. Link to post Share on other sites
gamera 0 Posted February 14, 2006 Share Posted February 14, 2006 Quote: Originally posted by number9: you can have written communication much more easily with the Chinese than non-kanji users. Sometimes I also do that written communication with guests from Chinese culture like from HongKong, Singapore etc. But a lot often their hand writing kanji are pretty differet from mine, sometimes hard to recognize which kanji they write. And because of gramatical difference, not 100% understandable. Chinese sentence is like English - S + V + O + C order. Japanese sentence is....... too flexible That's why when Japanese learn Chinese (Kanbun) in schools, usually books have some punctuation marks for beginner students to understand. Same alphabet in diffrent usage - this is much harder than different alphabet language. By the way number9 -番号九 bushpig -藪豚 Maybe? Link to post Share on other sites
bushpig 0 Posted February 14, 2006 Share Posted February 14, 2006 猪だよ。 Link to post Share on other sites
number9 0 Posted February 14, 2006 Share Posted February 14, 2006 Yeah, obviously you're not going to have 100% communication just because you each know kanji as they're different sets. But there's many of the kanji are the same, and if effort is made on each side to adapt to eachother (like 火車 is a train and 汽車 is a car in Chinese, not simplified), then using kanji should be more helpful than just verbal and gesture communications. Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts